Havre de Grace High School has a program called Drama Therapy that was developed with good intentions and is promoted by Harford County Public Schools. So why are parents having such a hard time getting access to the content?
Drama Therapy takes the form of short plays addressing serious issues like incest, teen suicide, sexual abuse, recovered memories and substance abuse. The plays are performed by Havre de Grace HS students and some of the plays are written by the school’s students or alumni. The plays have been presented to students during the school day and to the public in an evening performance.
According to the HCPS newspaper, Harford Schools, Drama Therapy was jointly developed by Havre de Grace HS teachers and school counselors. Clearly, Drama Therapy was planned to be more than entertainment.
Co-developer and drama teacher Mark Cummins wrote in the program for this year’s performance that he sought help from the Guidance Department from the beginning, “since the play’s issues are directly related to their counseling duties.” He goes on to urge anyone, but especially students, “dealing with any of these issues that are brought up in these plays…” to contact the school guidance counselors. Contact information is on the back cover of the program. In the past, counseling for students was reportedly also offered through the Harford County Health Department.
Drama Therapy was expected to prompt reactions from some students that would require counseling. So it wouldn’t be unreasonable for parents to expect a heads up.
But in the following letter to The Dagger, Havre de Grace HS parent Rachel Tate writes that the school did not notify parents or gain their consent prior to the presentation of Drama Therapy at a mandatory general assembly on December 4, 2009. Since then, she says that parents have been asking to review the program “in order to understand the content, not to invoke censure” and she can’t understand why parents have been met with stonewalling from school officials. She also says that the school system’s actions are a violation of the Protection of Pupil Rights Amendment (PPRA), risking the loss of federal funding.
Tate told The Dagger that she doesn’t doubt that Drama Therapy may lead some students to get help. But she questions whether school personnel are qualified to execute a large group, therapeutic intervention and to properly assist students in the aftermath, especially those who don’t reach out for counseling. She also questions how parents can fully support their students without access to the content.
Tate says she has been trying since December 8th to get a video tape or a transcript. She says Principal Patricia Walling told her that the video tape was not available because it was being edited and offered a copy of the scripts instead. But a few days later, Walling said in an email that four of the scripts were written by students as class work and couldn’t be released due to “school policy” and additional copyrighted material couldn’t be released either. Walling said she would check with Cummins about a way for Tate to gain access to the copyrighted material through a paid web site. Walling’s email was friendly enough, but Tate says she never heard back about the website and that while she and other parents have been promised the edited tape at some point, they want to see it now and unedited.
Tate and several other parents then met with Executive Director of Secondary Education Dave Volrath. From Tate’s letter, it looks like Volrath dismissed concerns about the impact of Drama Therapy on students. Tate says Volrath told parents that he didn’t want a story to hit The Aegis and he reiterated that copies of the scripts couldn’t be given out because they were copyrighted. So Tate asked if parents could simply read a copy at the school, without taking it home. She said Volrath took her phone number to make arrangements to meet at school the next day, December 18th.
When Volrath didn’t call at the appointed time, Tate called Volrath’s office. She was told Volrath was out, on his way back from Havre de Grace High, and Tate expressed upset over the missed meeting. But Volrath has never called her.
When reached for comment, Volrath told The Dagger that he did not dismiss parents concerns, only that he had no evidence that students had been harmed. Regarding his statement about The Aegis, Volrath said that he told parents he did not want student work and/or copyrighted material to appear in the paper.
In her letter, Tate writes that she and other parents are “surprised and disappointed that it has come to this” and she wonders if school officials are hoping to exhaust parents’ efforts through “delay tactics.”
The Dagger contacted HCPS in early December with questions about Drama Therapy after we got a tip from a reader. On December 14th, we received the following email from Assistant Superintendent of Curriculum and Instruction Roger Plunkett:
At the request of Dr. Tomback, Mr. Volrath is looking into the situation and will prepare a detailed report to the Superintendent.
Is there some reason for HCPS to circle the wagons? Hopefully not, but parents shouldn’t have to work this hard to review program materials. And a consent form with an opt-out provision is nothing new. Like any HCPS parent, I’ve signed dozens, most recently for the movie Schindler’s List. Why not for DramaTherapy?
While we await more from HCPS, Tate is calling on parents to “raise their voices in support of parental rights” by attending the next Board of Education Meeting scheduled for Monday, January 11 at 8:30 p.m. in the HCPS A.A. Roberty Administration Building in Bel Air.
Here’s the full text of Rachel Tate’s letter:
Harford County parents are in danger of losing more than a foothold on parental rights in the public school system while Harford County Public Schools may be in jeopardy of having federal funding revoked if resolutions cannot be reached regarding the controversial dramatherapy intervention program which was held without parental knowledge or consent at Havre de Grace High School on Friday, December 4, 2009.
All Harford County parents must make their presence known at the next Harford County Board of Education meeting, or the school board and HCPS administration may misconstrue their absence as permission to establish a dangerous precedent enabling teachers and administrators to arbitrarily deny parental access to any and all materials used during the school day in any one of the county’s public schools.
The program in question was designed to address hard-hitting issues such as rape, incest, abortion, suicide, teenage sexuality, teenage promiscuity, bullying, underage drinking and drunk driving. The program involves therapeutic interventions prescribed and implemented by Mr. Cummins, the dramatherapy advisor and carried out with the approval of HHS principal, Mrs. Walling.
Programs such as this are stark representations as to why the Hatch Amendment of 1984/PPRA was enacted by the United States Congress. HHS and HCPS officials violated the provisions set forth in this amendment by choosing not to notify parents of this program, denying parents’ oversight and review opportunity, ignoring federal stipulations that an opt-out policy be followed and conducting intrusive psychological interventions which may have caused public embarrassment to the student and/or the students’ family.
HHS [Havre de Grace High School] and HCPS officials have seemingly closed ranks in protection of their own against parental outcry and confrontation. Parents seeking answers as to the content of this program have been quick to say they did not step up in an effort to censure free speech, nor did they wish to disparage the students who performed in the dramatherapy. Parents asked to view the video and read the script out of concern for their own students and a desire to evaluate the accuracy of the word on the street.
The vast majority of HHS parents remain unaware that the captive student audience, held at the mercy of the current administration, was coerced to undergo what could be deemed an experimental approach to dramatherapy; as it does not appear to have been constructed within the guidelines set forth by the National Association of Drama Therapists, nor does it adhere to standard clinical practices of assessing each patient’s individual needs and tailoring a treatment plan to achieve specific outcomes. One parent’s response to the notion that this was therapy was “if you aim at the broadside of the barn, you are bound to hit something.” It should also be noted that another parent who attended the Thursday evening show with his son said that he found the program helpful. Attending alongside a student certainly allows for follow up and awareness of the students’ response. Parents who remain unaware of the program or who have asked for more information are not privy to those details.
According to data from safechild.org, it is estimated that one in four girls and one in six boys will suffer sexual abuse before the age of 18. It is most likely, then, to anticipate that approximately 150-180 students potentially endured unwarranted secondary victimization while watching one of the skits which portrayed an incest survivor experiencing flashbacks triggered by memories which surfaced during a drinking game at a girls’ sleepover.
Parents must stand strong against opinions such as those expressed by Mr. Volrath, HCPS Executive Director of Secondary Schools, who in his remarks to concerned parents said, “Well, for the most part no harm was done.” Parents contend that the negative impact on students cannot begin to be quantified because no intake interviews were conducted regarding the issues posing difficulties for individuals within the student body. Neither were exit interviews or debriefing sessions conducted to provide a time and place for further exploration, analysis and proactive strategy planning to help students identify positive coping mechanisms for managing the substantive personal issues they are facing. If Volrath, who admitted he had not read the script or seen the video, is correct, then why has it been impossible for parents to gain access?
Events like this make sense of the severe penalty levied when public school officials display such willful disregard for parents’ and students’ rights. The loss of federal funding is the penalty for such egregious neglect of the provisions addressed in the Hatch Amendment of 1984. That is quite a high price to pay for negligence, willful or not.
At this time, HCPS and HHS school officials have responded to requests to view a videotape of the dramatherapy program by stating that arrangements will be made to release the information when it is returned from the editing process. Parents have requested to view the original, raw, unedited footage from the December 4 assembly and do not understand why the tape was not able to be picked up from the videographer’s home in Cecil County and made available before the editing process began. One parent, who spoke with the videographer, learned within days after the assembly that editing was not going to be started before January. The question becomes why didn’t the school system request the video, show it to parents and return it in time for editing to begin in January?
Some parents are getting the impression that the full impact of violations are not being taken seriously by top level administration officials. They fear that once everyone returns following the holiday break, officials may attempt to exhaust parents’ patience and time resources with delay tactics. As there has absolute refusal to open the full script to parents who have made such a request, it seems a bit early to bank on the promise that the video will be presented.
Parents making the requests are surprised and disappointed that it has come to this, especially as the initial inquiry by one parent was to see the tape in order to understand the content, not to invoke censure. The response by the school system of “slamming the door” in that parent’s face has piqued the interest of every parent who learns of the incident. The use of a school-wide assembly to present such controversial information without parental knowledge or consent has been met with parental responses ranging from very upset to not worry at all. However, parents are in agreement that parental rights have been violated. Parental response to that is “Now, I want to see that tape!”
Parents interested in raising their voices in support of parental rights are encouraged to make their presence known at the January 11, 2010 Board of Education meeting which will be held at the HCPS A.A. Roberty Building at 8:30 p.m. For more information on how to be involved, please contact HCPSconcernedparents@hotmail.com or call 410-652-0250.
UPDATE:
Parents who have been trying since early December to gain access the content of Drama Therapy at Havre de Grace High School have been invited to view a DVD of the program in the school’s media center on Thursday, January 7th at 6:30 p.m. The invitation came in the form of an email late Tuesday from Principal Patricia Walling. The DVD is expected to be an original, unedited video of the presentation shown to students at a generally assembly at the school on December 4, 2009.
Drama Therapy is a series of short plays dealing with serious issues including teen suicide, incest, recovered memory and substance abuse. The program was developed in concert with school guidance counselors, and students were urged to seek counseling after seeing the plays if necessary.
Parents at the school first requested access to the content material on December 8, upon learning about the general assembly and given the nature of the program. Their requests were first made public on Monday in a Letter to The Dagger from Havre de Grace parent Rachel Tate.
This is a developing story.
“The vast majority of HHS parents remain unaware that the captive student audience, held at the mercy of the current administration, was coerced to undergo what could be deemed an experimental approach to dramatherapy” Wow–maybe this parent could put on a drama of her own….she is certainly OVERdramatic enough here!
You all crack me up! Do you have any ideas what issues your kids see on TV and in the movies you let them watch. Oh wait, I am sure YOUR children have never seen anything above a PG rated movie without you, huh? Wake up! Better to have the issues out in the open where students can see it is okay to talk about them and get help for them than by shutting them in a closet.
Those parents who think the school system is so harmful should pull them out. Most of you don’t have day jobs…so this will give you something to do rather than gossip around the neighborhood all day and create drama (pun intended) where none exists.
How glibbly you dismiss the true concern of parents who wish to remain involved in their children’s educations. As was intended by the Federal Regulations to which are referred, any potentially inciteful/contoversial material is meant to be reviewed and a decision made by the parents as to how certain matters will addressed and discussed on their own terms. The regulations offer the opportunity to review and consider whether or not they wish their chilren to learn about these matters at school or at home. Parents may not have “opted out” on allowing their children to view the performance and they would have been able to be prepared to discuss the matters presented once the children had seen it. How can there be such an outcry against Mrs. Tate’s actions, now, when the matter was already addressed at the Federal Level in the 90’s under similar concerning situations? Our HCPS administrators chose to censure the President’s address this past fall and not air it until it had been deemed “acceptable” by the HCPS Administrators…why wouldn’t there be similar choices made within the system as regards these subject matters? Yes, the way in which the matters were presented to the students was “therapeutic” if you choose to believe that one can gain therapeutic benefit without personal, integral, one-on-one discussion. Why not get your therapy from the TV or radio as well? As for whether or not my children (who are not yet in high school) have had access to such subject matter on TV…yes, they may have seen some material with mature subject matters but nothing like what was presented on that stage on December 3 and 4. And it was not without consequence when the discovery was made: “You want to watch this stuff? Then we’re gonna talk about it. Discuss not just the titillating parts but also discuss the potential outcomes of such behavior and how to handle similar situations if you find yourself in the middle of one.” Only in this manner are parents able to pass on their own morals and values as the matters are raised not prematurely and all at once. If not for concerned parents like Rachel Tate, most of us who don’t have “high schoolers” wouldn’t have known about this matter and more time would have passed without someone taking a stand. I think it is interesting that our Art Classes do not permit portrayal of any subject matters that are lewd, vulgar or illegal (rape, foul language, drugs…)in their students’ art work. This is the personal expression of one student as may be experienced by the Art Teacher and possibly by the students in attendance of the class itself. But it is not permitted per HCPS policy. How, therefore, can it be acceptable to inflict physical and verbal presentations on students of the school at large in a “mandatory attendance” event? As for these productions having been performed over the last few years without similar outcries, be assured that I know of faculty who has taken offence at the previous productions and walked out of them. I have been told by one of them that this year’s performance certainly “crossed lines” never previously crossed. This faculty member has spoken up over the past few years and their opinions have been dismissed. I know Rachel won’t be dismissed and I know that I won’t be…I’ll be there beside her on Monday evening to show my support for her actions. Atta girl, Rachel! Keep the banner flying!
I am one of “those parents” who would like to be able to pull my kids out of school but can’t afford to. What an insulting comment. Maybe if there was school choice like more charter schools or vouchers many more parents could do just that.
The only parents who have school choice in the public school system are school system employees who can send their kids to any school in the county regardless of overcrowding or anything else. Doesn’t seem quite right and smacks of hypocrisy.
Hi, I find your comment about school employess ridiculous. Maybe there are teachers who take there kids to the school they work at…wouldnt you…if you were a teacher? To criticize school employees was wrong of you…and not really related to the topic at hand.Also, you might want to check the HCPS laws and regulations for employees;because I do believe- you might be incorrect on your information.Since, you made the “cant afford” statement yourself…have you seen a paycheck of a teacher/Instructional Ass’t(school employees)? Do you know how much money a teacher puts into their own classroom to provide better lessons for your children? Maybe bringing their child to their work to attend school is a help to their financial situation…because no one goes into teaching for the money. Most people go into teaching for the love of the job, the kids and for the needs of their own family.If you want to blame people….why dont you write letters to the developers who continue to build in areas whose schools are already overcrowded.Thank you.
I totally agree with you Local Citizen. I am an alumni of HHS and i know that Drama therapy was a great show. All these parents need to get over this. We see and probably know alot more than you think. Parental permission shouldnt be needed for something like this. This is all ridiculous. We all know what Drama therapy offers, thats why we go. To learn. I know my parents didnt teach me about rape or suicide, but drama therapy did. Im proud of Mr. Cummins for doing such excellent work with his students. And i know i speak for a lot of the students when i say Save Drama Therapy!
I would like to know what psychiatric professional sanctioned these performances, and what real benefit this program offers to real victims of these terrible crimes. I would guess none. I just feel that school is simply not the place to deal with these issues.
I know that some of the supporters of dramatherapy are simply interested in the performance aspect, not the content. These kids just want to be on stage in a production, any production.
If you think that parental permission should not be needed for this, then why did I have to sign a consent for Health class? That seems pretty simple right? Why should I sign for that and not a monumentally more significant thing like portrayals of rape and incest? Does not make sense AT ALL!!
My feeling is that the school system thinks it knows better than I do what is good for my kids. I think they need to be reminded exactly where their paychecks come from- me!!!
You are obviously one of those clueless, hands off parents who are content to let your child/children do as they please with as little parental guidance as possible. Yes I have a day job, two as a matter of fact, as does my husband,and my husband and I are very involved in our childrens education. So no gossiping around the neighborhood here. The only people creating drama are the school system. Why didn’t they honor a simple request? What do they have to hide? The fact that this assembly happened with no knowledge or consent of parents is an absolute outrage!! Any decent parent would be concerned by the lack of notification on the part of the school administration. Oh and BTW, man up and put your name on your comment!!!
Additionally, you have a picture of the schoo’s marquee with the assembly clearly noted, named, and time given. If this parent was so interested in the content, why didn’t she attend with her child? If it is on the marquee, the school is obviously not trying to hide it.
Chalk this one up to another infuriating article in The Dagger that is one-sided, biased, and written by a wanna be journalist.
Good point in fact it seems that this was advertised and you where encouraged to attend. Not to mention if I recall she missed her 18th appt. does she expect school personel to call from home on their break?
Mrs. Tate didn’t miss the appointment…Mr. Volrath failed to honor his committment to contact Mrs. Tate when he was at Havre de Grace High School the day following their initial meeting.
I don’t know about you but most people arrange meetings by setting a time not calling and keeping you on the line. SOunds fishy.
Look I am not claiming that parents should not have the right to review material. I also think the school erred in the fact it should have sent home an opt out form. Maybe even an alert now message since we know High School kids on average fail to bring these things home. But to say the admin sneaked this in when it was on the marqee is a little far. Also to wait 11 days to voice a concern as some people have or not be patient when you are playing monday morning quarter back, as is the case here. Is a litle far.
I again ask Mrs. Tate when did she become aware of the performance and When did she voice her concern?
Cdev, I feel many parents saw the information on the marquee, but I don’t know that it registered with many. I know it didn’t with me. (Please note, it was listed as a production, not a mandatory assembly.) My child had another commitment that evening, so when one is strapped for time and it doesn’t appear it will affect you personally, one tends not to pay attention.
It was while I was attending my child’s swim meet that I first really heard about the production. Mainly because several key swimmers were not in attendance as they were participating in the performance.
I then received a call from my friend who asked if I would watch or review the script with her because she was concerned about what she was hearing from others regarding the performance. Philosophically, we hold different opinions on many subjects. Yet please know that I truly admire her because instead of reaching out to someone like-minded, she sought out me. Mainly because of our differences. To answer your question on the time line, this was less than three days after the event.
Now my confusion, a seemingly simple request – “May I please see/read the content that was presented to my child in school?” has been met with obstacles, stonewalling and a myriad of excuses. If the school stands behind it, where it the difficulty in providing the content to the parents for informed awareness. This should not be difficult. Yet, it continues to be. Please know this challenge is not about content. How can it be, we have yet to see/read the content? Even knowing the premise of some of the content, I am fairly certain that I would have opted in for allowing my child to see the production as a mandatory assembly in school. I would however have appreciated as the parent of a student at HHS to be ready for any discussion that it may have generated. I was afforded that opportunity from my son’s health class, when sex education was taught, why not this?
Despite the many concerns that are being addressed, I still can’t even say to you that I would like to see the event go away. I do however expect the option to know it is happening, specifically topics that are to be covered. (Heck even video games and movies are rated based on content). I would like to see the HCPS partner with county resources such as the Office of Mental Health to be available after a mandatory production. Remember this was billed not as a play, but “therapy”.
I also believe this is our opportunity as parents and school system alike to help teach our children positive coping skills, both through the production of the play and the aftermath we now face.
The school system has made great inroads to communicating with parents through new technologies – Alert calls, Web sites, Edline alerts, etc. This is one of these times, it should have been utilized. I for one would have appreciated it.
How does it “sound fishy?” The man committed to call Mrs. Tate when he was at the High School and had the script “in hand” for Mrs. Tate to read. She lives within 3 minutes of the high school and was willing to wait upon Mr. Volrath’s convenience per mutual agreement. He failed to call her as he had promised he would do. He was at the high school during the hours agreed upon as was confirmed by Mr. Volrath’s executive assistant when Mrs. Tate called (after waiting until 2pm for him to comply with his promise)his office. There’s no “fishy” to it, it was the beginning of the series of failed communications and commitments that Mrs. Tate has faced since the inception of this matter. Stop looking to Mrs. Tate as the “fall guy”. She is not at fault here, the HCPS administration is!
Fishy because most people set up meetings by setting a time. Just seems odd. Did she try calling the school office?
Read the updated article.
Local Citizen,,
Ignorance and denial and lack of involvement on your part (and whatever guilt or inadequacy that you may feel about those things)are no reasons to attack a well-researched and presented article such as the one above. If you HAD been engaged in the process or paying attention for the past several years, you’d realize that what Cindy is reporting on is part of a disgraceful pattern of stone-walling and disrespect that emanates from Mr. Volrath. We are all counting on Dr. Tomback to do something about that.
And, by the way, you completely missed the point of the article…..but I’m not surprised about that. Happy New Year.
Just because the marquee says “Drama Therapy” doesn’t mean that a parent passing by the school would know anything about it. That is if they even go by the school. No one is claiming the school is trying to hide the performance, parents are questioning the content and want the opportunity to opt out. If this parent wasn’t informed about it via letter or e-mail, how would she even know what it was?
What is so one sided about this article anyway? The school system had a chance to comment about it and deal with it when a parent brought it up. The school system employs three people to do their PR work and crank out good news stories. The parents in this county are on their own if they have problems but I do hope the Harford County Council of PTA’s looks at this issue and considers advocating for the parents in this community.
No, but involved parents might say that sounds odd and ask their kid about it. Especially if you are in to reviewing the content of the things your kid is exposed to I would expect you would ask questions. If this was the school play, as it was and I didn’t recognize the title I would try to find out about it. Mostly so I could decide if I wanted to go see it. An honest question….If an opt out form had been sent home with your children, How many of you believe it would have been shown to you?
I, too, am waiting for the PTA’s support. What if one of the officers has expressed ambivilance about the matter and doesn’t wish to proceed to take action neccessary to make the PTA’s support known? If the PTA has been consulted on the matter where is their “voice”?
There is no mention on the school marquee about the assembly that was held during school time. The marquee mentions only the Thursday 7:00 p.m. performance that was open to the public. On Thursday evening, is was on option to attend, or not attend. Anyone who was uncomfortable, parents who did not find the content appropriate, or any person who wanted to leave at any time could have done so freely. The assembly was held on Friday, during school hours, and each student was required to attend.
Just to clarify for those readers who may not understand the issue at hand, the subject matter has not been contested. The issue at hand is that federal law, state, county and local policies each provide for parents to be given access to controversial educational issues and materials before they are to be presented. Furthermore, parents are guaranteed access to review all curricula. As was stated in Mumby’s article and my letter, the content is not being disputed. The refusal by HHS and HCPS to allow access is in direct conflict with the law, and as such, it should be disputed. Feel free to follow up via email at hcpsconcernedparents@hotmail.com.
Are you kidding me!? Of course your debating the content! We wouldn’t even be having this conversation if the plays were related to a subject matter that you found agreeable. It it obvious to see that the reason you have lead this crusade is because you found the subject matter offensive, period. You’re not fooling anyone with your “parental rights” nonsense.
Suppose one of the plays promoted the notion that abortion should be made illegal? What if I then raised the same concerns you have? I bet that you would not support me.
Besides, in this situation, do think that giving parents the right to choose to opt their son or daughter out is really the best decision? This could give an abusive parent the opportunity to prevent their child from coming to terms with things that may have happened in the past. Congrats, you just enabled an abuser.
P.S. As a former journalism student I would just like to express that I feel that the blatant bias in this article is disgraceful. This is not real reporting.
I will be contacting the school office tomorrow and will express my support for their decisions. I encourage others to do the same. (410) 939-6600.
Former Student,
You may be a former journalism student, but you are clearly not a former student of logic or reason. Wow! ….. talk about ascribing your own preconceptions to someone else’s argument. Pretty laughable.
Obviously this “Former Student” didn’t fare too well in the journalism classes. You missed the point of the article which was that parents are not being allowed to be included in the education of their children. Last time I checked most material is available to parents for them to read and assist their children in understanding its meaning. The author has given both sides an opportunity to express their viewpoint, however the Superintendent chose the response
“At the request of Dr. Tomback, Mr. Volrath is looking into the situation and will prepare a detailed report to the Superintendent.”
Apparently not giving a response the the author. The oly thing I would suggest to the author is that they try and contact the Superintendent again and state that in the article to avoid this confusion.
The sentence “Of course your debating the content!” from your post is using the possessive form “your” when you should have used the contracted form “you’re”. But what do I know, I am not a journalism student.
P.S. If I am wrong about any of this(including grammar), I reiterate “I am not a journalism student”
I ask that all readers before commenting REREAD the beginning of the article. You will see that the debate is NOT about the subject matter. It is that HHS has decided that they do not have to share with a parent information that they have put in front of a student. I agree that any subject matter that is presented in a public school should be available to ANY parent that wants to see it. It does not matter what the individual parenting style, morals, beliefs, or religion is. There are a lot of parents whose children have to attend public school because of finances. They are not able to home school or afford private education. Reread the article and you will see that the debate is NOT about the subject matter presented. I am a former student of HHS and a non conservative parent. I have an alumni student of HHS as well as a current student and a Middle School student.
Well said, Christina.
It seems to me that this is being blown a little out of proportion. Or at least the amount of outrage being displayed is perhaps premature.
The Drama Therapy productions have been happening at Haver de Grace for the past few years, and this is the first time that I’ve heard of any controversy. I believe that they typically present these original one-act plays as the school’s Fall Drama Production….and that the school-wide assembly was probably envisioned as a school presentation of the fall play….(not intended to really be a large group therapy session.) — Although it was developed with the support of the school’s guidance department.
I’m a little confused about the excuses being given about access to the material…if HHS has purchased the scripts to present them,the books themselves belong to the school — unless the parents are planning on presenting their own version of the play without paying royalties, they should be able to at least see the scripts. .. Maybe if communication hadn’t been messed up and the meeting at the school had happened, she would have been able to read the scripts the 18th.
The following two weeks were full of snow and school closings, so I can understand how her requests have been pushed off since then.
The tone of the letter just seems a bit harsh for a situation that probably hasn’t played out fully yet. Ms. Walling is certainly not a tyrant who holds her student body captive and subjects them mercilessly to evil drama productions. Mr. Cummins is a drama teacher who is trying to use his classes and the art of theatre to make a productive difference in the school community, and the Guidance department is equipped to handle the problems of the youth in the school.
This whole thing does seem to be a bit over-dramatic.
PDC when doing a play you do not own the books or scripts, you buy the rights to present it and the script is on loan. You are required to return them and destroy any copies within a given amount of time afterwards.
That said had the 18th meeting occured as planed this would not be an issue.
My next question for the writer is as follows. On what date did you learn of the production? What date did you make a request for the material?
CDev,
You’re not quite right….For most plays, you purchase the scripts and they can remain in your own library. YOu are required to fill out a preformance application and pay royalty fees for any performances that you are presenting. Most of the theatrical licensing companies (Samuel French, Dramatists Play Service, Playscripts, Inc., etc…) work this way.
Your scenario is more common in the performance of musical theatre… Where you rent the librettos and scores from the licensing company and return all the materials at the end of your production period. (Although sometimes, esp. with Samuel French, you are required to purchase the scripts and are only renting the musical materials)…
That being said, I would expect that HHS has copies of the scripts that they used for the productions. (at least the ones that are not student written) — as for the student generated scripts, I would seem that any privacy issues would be forfeited since the work was presented for the public a number of times.
FERPA would proclude you from seeing the actual writing of the student. But not a typed copy of it.
…and I can’t imagine that the actors in the production perpared their performance from the original writing, but from a typed copy….
It shouldn’t be hard to get access to these things — However, given the time of year (Midterms and winter break) combined with the timing of the school closings — seem to make the accusation that the school officials are intentionally withholding these documents from the parents a little premature.
It is interesting that the parents are in an uproar about something that they could have investigated beforehand — This is the fourth year that the school has presented an evening of student one-acts titled “Drama Therapy” — and the production / perrformance was advertised well in advance not only at HHS, but also on the HCPS website in the Fall Drama Production list.
There was also an article about the production in the Sun:
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/harford/bal-md.ha.drama05dec05,0,4954501.story
Also, the discussion about the story not being about the content of the performance but more about the parental rights seems a bit skewed…
Ms. Tate refers to the plays as a “Dramatherapy intervention program” in the first paragraph of her lettern and goes on to bring up the content of the plays throughout her letter.
Would this be a similar issue if the parents were concerned about the school’s production of , let’s say, “The Wizard of Oz” –because of the portrayal of witchcraft… And were denied copies of the script after the fact because they had already been sent back to the licensing company?
Agreed but who knows. Maybe some of the scripts are improved. I don’t know but I agree considering school closings etc it is a bit premature to be in an uproar. Especially when you waited until AFTER. As I said below to the one post you want an imediate response to a letter it took you 11 days to get around to writing!
The word is: “p-r-e-c-l-u-d-e”.
Thanks for the spelling lessons
I am aware of a suicide prevention program developed by persons I know that reside in the midwest. The program consists of recorded dialogs that promote an adgenda of guilt…amassing guilt in the form of voices from the dead laying blame for suicides on such horribly evil things as…. NON HOMOSEXAUAL BEHAVIOUR…NOT BEING A MINORITY..ACCELLING IN SCHOOL….PARENTAL DISCIPLINE…OBSTANING FROM DRUG USE.
Go Dagger !
While I am unsure as to your intent with this comment I wish to clarify a few things. Hopefully, your improper use/misspelling of the following words was unintentional: not “non homosexaual behaviour” is is “non-homosexual behavior”, not “accelling” it is “excelling”, not “obstaning” it is “abstaining.”
Go Rachel Tate….wow you can be short in words.Annoying and rude too. Really to correct postings;now we get it-you are “one of those parents”.;)People write quickly on here and they don’t always have time to spell check. You can’t even come up with your own name;have to play on Rachel Tate’s name.Rah Rah!
My comment more directed towards the tone of the included letter, as well as the attached comment. Undoubtedly the article itself is trying to make the point that parents should have the right to be more involved in school related materials if they so choose, but I feel that Mrs. Tate’s letter does not do enough to convince me that she truly has no concerns regarding the content, as she reiterated above. I feel that she is trying to mask her opinions regarding the content in another issue all together.
Btw guys, gimme a break about the “your” haha. I still getting used to typing on this new iPhone and it always seems to auto-correct the wrong way. Sweet that dagger has an iPhone friendly page though 😉
Another thought that continues to bother me today is the comment made by Mr. Volrath. His comment of “Well, for the most part no harm was done” really seems very insulting to me. Which child gets to be the least part? Yours, Mine, your neighbors? I have had 2 of my children view this Drama Therapy. One was not outwardly bothered. The other was bothered enough to tell me that she wished she could have not been there because it made her upset.
So does that mean that since 1 of my children is fine with it that it is to bad for the one that is not?
How am I supposed to help her when MY letter dated the 15th of December asking questions about what my daughter saw was ignored as well. It is hard enough to understand and delve into the teenage mind without there being topics and visuals I don’t know about and can’t research.
There is nothing shown in the movies or on TV that can not be researched if you have a need to do so.
Mr. Volrath’s flippant comment is disturbing in that it shows a disregard for the least of these children.
OK you waited until the 15th of December to write a letter about something that happened 11 days before. Assuming you mailed it on the 15th then let us assume it was recieved on the 17th there has been two school days between that day and now! You took 11 and are complaining about them not answering a letter and mailing it to you in 2?
I will explain further even though it will of course not matter to CDEV. I work night shift work and the assembly was on a Friday. My one on one time with my Daughters was during the following week. My letter was written the exact date that I felt there was a problem and wanted to find out more information. The letter was emailed to the school not postmarked and the “read receipt” is dated the same day as the letter was sent. My request was simply to find out what the assembly was about and covered. Since my request I have been enlightened to the further problems.
Also when schools are closed for students they are not necessarily closed for employees. As well as the fact that all administration of HCPS have access to their email from home. A reply could have been sent explaining what the delay was.
OK I understand you may work nights. So let’s look at this Yes on some days SOME employees go. I think the Snow Days where flexible leave and the it was the 28-30 of December I believe. So you expect school employees to take their time with their families to e-mail you back? Not to mention instant replies are not always possible. Maybe they needed to get information to help better answer your questions. So I am to understand you only spend time with your daughters once and a while, like 11 days later?
As a parent, I find it interesting as I questioned the content of this production when my daughter spoke of it. I won’t pretend to be pious or shocked, but when I have to sign off on my child’s “family life unit” where they learn about intercourse and talk about the vagina and penis in the most sterile of discussions, I would expect the school to get my permission for my child to be exposed to topics such as incest, homosexuality, sexual abuse, teen-aged drinking, etc. Or, at the very least, inform the parents so they are able to opt out of such material, as we do for health class.
Some of these skits/plays had little consequences for bad/inappropriate behavior, or at least that is what MY daughter got out of it. The student body, as a whole, did seem to enjoy it, but with salacious topics and foul language it certain appeals to the audience intended. HHS administrators and staff should have thought a bit more about the topic and given informed consent to the parents.
On a side note you most likely did not sign off on the discussions of teenage drinking and drinking and driving when discussed in 8th grade science or health depending on the school?
To clarify,well said Cindy Baker!
I was informed in the way of a syllabus about those topics when my daughter was in 8th grade.
Let’s not be coy about this; incest, homosexuality, and sexual abuse are far more “hot topic” buttons than teen-aged drinking. These topics being discussed do not personally offend me and if done in a structured, supportive manner, I feel, are appropriate to discuss in the high school atmosphere. The problem appear, it wasn’t structured, it wasn’t supportive, and was poorly thought out. The fact that materials cannot get to a parent in a timely fashion is proof of that. If the admin couldn’t have considered parental outrage, how could they begin to think about the depth of damage this could have caused a student or adult watching this that had been directly effected by incest, sexual abuse, or other topics performed?
The parents should have been informed. Once again, if they need my permission to say penis in class, they should need it for incest and foul language.
Don’t know what your kids said, but mine felt that all of the performances were irrelevant and a waste of their time.
Well said!
I hate to tell you but in high school kids are using language a lot stronger than penis and without parent permission.If you have not spent a day,while kids are in school, try it sometime. You will see that high school is a different world.
Your thoughts are good, if it was for elementary or middle school…
Also,this program was here the last couple of years…this is not a new idea.It was very structured and thought out.
I also think that parents throw a lot of stones at teachers…for offenses they themselves do and then some. What movies do your kids watch?Sexual Content? What web sites are they on? TV shows? That stuff is much worse then the information they were showed at “Drama Therapy”. The kids wouldnt have realized this was such a big deal;until the parents took it over and ran with it.
I never said I had a problem with the content. As a parent, I am responsible for my minor; I do not sign off my rights as parents when the school receives them. As someone who pays taxes and has a child in the school system, I should be made aware of what adults are exposing my child, a minor, to.
My child is on the computer, watches rated R movies, and know about these topics and words. This isn’t my bone of contention. When she is on the computer, watching these movies, etc. they are done so under my supervision. If something goes awry it is my duty to fix it. However, the school doesn’t know my values, does not know what my child sees at home, so why should they assume? Would it not have been the smart thing to send a simple letter home? The students had the option to go to a night performance as it was. Mrs. Tate has the right to see the material and considering the avoidance in meeting with her from HCPS officials it reeks of regret. Someone has the script at HHS and it should have been providing even given the snow days and vacation.
Officials always complain that parents are not involve; however, when they do get involved they complain that they are overbearing or unreasonable. While my daughter thought it was nicely done, she was shocked that they “went there”. And speaking of throwing stones, I do go to my school’s administrators and teachers when I feel things are not right. For some students, school is the only refuge from the topics discussed in Drama Therapy. Teachers cursing, throwing object out of anger, name calling and the like are totally inappropriate. Someone needs to be an adult.
Maybe you should consider a private school..because you can’t control all of that in a public school.(seriously doubt a private one either)I also think you need to trust in the school system a little more.Everyones values are different at the school….as you can see…one person objects to something and its ruined for all. One person doesnt like your religion…no more hanukah…no more Xmas trees etc.So, you and that whole group probably got done what you wanted..because I am sure “Drama Therapy” is over. If I was a school employee, I would work my hours and be done with it. No teaching “outside the box”…because a couple of parents disagree. So your kids didn’t agree with some of the content…so next time they know not to go. They discussed it with you;and you all had some learning and chatter about the subject. I think thats a lesson in itself. For those students that want to continue “Drama Therapy”…without we parents involved…that should also be an option. My point is…once they hit high school…our constant approval for everything they are exposed to is limited. Plus, I think its good to cut “apron strings” and let them experience awkward and comfortable things. If we shold shield them now…what are we going to do later in college…in adulthood…you arent going to be around all the time.
Yes, I see your point…its your kid and she is a minor…but she’s not in elementary school or middle…she is a young adult.Im sure if she is watching the R rated movies…they “go there” a lot more.So your saying its ok…as long as she is not at school…but at your house its fine…as long as you are supervising?or she is at a friends hose…or a friend of a friend? Ok….subject for me is done. Im sure you all wont have to worry about this next year…
By the way, I am curious that the reason they might not want you all seeing a transcript is for the safety of the minors who acted out the skits…maybe they are worried that parents would be like…who is that? Why would she write that?etc. Since you all are handling it so well now?Just an idea. Or maybe its because
continued from below….maybe its because they were trying to tick you all off…so you would go to the school board…..I dont think so.
I totally agree. As a matter of a fact, we should just boycott the public school system and homeschool all of our kids in the basement where we can remove all of the cable and internet connections. I have one movie they can watch, the Little Mermaid and I even personally edited the film so she has on more clothes. My basement can fit about 12 students, and everyone is welcome to come, its first come first serve. Please call 1800IMPSYKO if you are interested.
Rachel, for you to say this is not about content is a complete joke! If it weren’t, then you would have been raising a fuss several years ago when the program didn’t ask for your permission when it first began. And as a parent who claims to be so involved in your children’s lives and learning, there is no doubt that you knew about the program several years ago. You contradict yourself in claiming this is not about the content, for if it were not, you wouldn’t be focusing so much on the fact that you have not been able to view a tape or script. Administrators have lives and schedules of their own. If you want to give permission for the thing your children hear and see at school, then you better start going to school with them and cover their ears as they simply walk through the halls. Rape, alcohol, prostitution and such all come up in history classes, but I don’t suppose you would object to Mrs. Hejl’s class. Perhaps you haven’t heard of the show The Secret Life of the American Teenager. I am willing to bet that your children are watching that show, and the content of that show is no different from that of Drama Therapy….it touches on sex, teen pregnancy, abortion, sexual abuse, death, alcohol, incest, you name it. But I suppose you don’t let your children watch the news then either. Not all of us care to shelter our children from the REAL world, but if that is your choice, then perhaps you should consider homeschooling. And maybe you might even consider renting the movie Tsotsi and watching it together.
Mr. & Mrs. Cummins are great teachers! They teach real content. Leave living in a fantasy world to Walt Disney
Finally someone with some sense!
I have to agree with #12’s ‘a parent’.
If this argument was not based upon content, why wasn’t there an argument four years ago when Drama Therapy began? She was obviously offended by the difficult subjects, and then decided to voice her opinion about not receiving notice.
If you think that high schoolers don’t hear this kind of stuff just walking down the halls, I think you might need to think again.
I have a lot of respect for this person, as I know her personally. I just wish she would tell the truth. We all know this is based, (maybe not the argument currently at hand, but BASED) purely on the content of this years Drama Therapy performance.
The REAL world…The real world where my child is sent home from school for wearing a t-shirt with the word Budweiser on it. The real world where my child is not allowed to participate in health class topics because the permission slip was not signed to talk about mundane sex organs. The real world is this..PARENTS have rights by LAW to see what is put before their children. You do not need to like Rachel Tate. You do not have to have the same values. In America everyone gets to raise their children with their own morals and expose their children to what they want. Why do you attack Rachel when all she and others want is to see what was put before her children in a PUBLIC SCHOOL.
You are enjoying the FREEDOM of speech that American gives you. Why can’t people with values different than your own enjoy the same FREEDOM of speech and refer to the law that protects them.
Also..Public school is a right to all children. Our taxes pay for it.Why should any of us have to take our children home and home school them. Every child in America has the right to a free quality education. I can’t have my child use the word GOD, Celebrate the Christ child’s birth, Have an Easter Holiday and more. If I can not expose people to things that are good than why does the public school get to expose children to things that are bad just because the exist in the world.
Public school is certainly a right to all students. It is, however, not up to you to determine what is apprpriate and not appropriate based on your own biases. Because you believe some things are “good” does not make them so.
In exposing children to the realities of life, some of which are “bad”, they are opening up an avenue for discussion and communication. Something that may not be happening in their home, or that they are not comfortable discussing in their home. If minor discomfort is the rsult for some, then so be it.
I agree with you to an extent. There is a role for parents to play in determining appropriatness of content. The role however is not as clear as whole sale making of decisions unilaterally. In this case I think the smart move before hand would have been an opt out form or a alert now heads up.
I do think a parent should have the right to view the material afterwards as it seems this parent wanted but to expect the turn around to be fast on that given the reality of snow days, christmas break and that the material is not imediately availible for those being asked to distribute is a little over the top. the 4th as I believe was a friday so assuming the request was made and recieved on the 8th it may have taken time to get the material. 8th being a wednesday I wonder how long they waited before going to Mr. Volrath. a one day response time is not a reasonable expectation. As someone pointed out a school administrator has many items on their plate. While this was important to the individual it may not have been the top priority. By the time the person may have been able to address it they had already moved on to go over the head. Was a follow-up e-mail sent saying something to the effect of “you said you where going to do X, Y and Z and I haven’t heard from you” Or did the party move on to just calling the board?
No in the midst of this discussion we seem to have some who just want to view the content so they can address it at home and some who wish to censor the content and some who simply want someones head on a platter the first group is the most reasonable request the second is overstepping their role and the third will never be satisfied in any meaningful way.
yes they have the right to attend public school, but if you don’t like the content, you have the right to send them elsewhere. You do not have the right to dictate what every other child is or isn’t allowed to see and hear in school
No, all I wanted was the right to control what my own kids are exposed to, like any responsible parent. Insulating them is not the answer, but shoving this stuff in their faces is not right either.
Why can’t you have your child say GOD, celebrate Christ’s Birth or have Easter? That’s ridiculous. Who has told you that your child can’t do these things. If you feel that it is the school system you are sorely mistaken. Maybe you don’t know as much about student and parent rights as you think you do. It can’t be preached in public schools but students have the right to use the word GOD, celebrate Christmas and Easter even if the school employees use generic terms like “Happy Holidays!”. Additionally, while I understand your discussion on parental rights I am offended that the assumption seems to be that the school would be so haphazard in their presentation of such delicate topics that they would cause some kind of mass panic. Really?
If you let your kid wear a shirt reading BUDWEISER on it to school, then you are an idiot. And you’ll wonder why your kid doesn’t think underaged drinking is wrong. It’s called common sense, lady.
Good point!
Replying to your post is probably a waste of time but I will try to clarify and give an answer.
I do not wake up every morning and scrutinize what my child has on her body. In the past one of my children put on her father’s t-shirt and went to school. This shirt was a plain navy blue t-shirt with a gold emblem of a bottle cap on it. It was worn inside a hoodie. For whatever reason it was revealed and I had to go to the school and bring her a new shirt.
My point was in the ridiculous nature of HHS enforcing only the HCPS policies they want to.
I am sure there is someone who would like to pick this apart to.
I refer again to my original comments that all I did was ask to see the content in order to answer my Middle School students questions as she attended the Thursday night assembly with her High School sister.
I have seen numerous comments that this content was not appropriate for Middle School.
My point is that it would have been nice to know the type of content Drama Therapy covers before hand. The Marquee does not tell you, there was nothing sent home from HCPS or HHS, there was nothing on Edline, or the website about the content. Because it was an HHS production and there are HCPS policies on sex, drugs, alcohol and such I trusted it was appropriate for students.
When my child came to me with questions I asked my new high school child about it. From the information gathered I then asked for a viewing or script to read.
Again the STONEWALLING caused this debate.
Wait, so it was your middle school student who had the questions about a high school production?
In any case, there’s no reason why you shouldn’t be able to get a copy on the content (or at least review it at the school), but I think accusing HCPS of stonewalling after a couple of weeks of not getting the result you wanted is bit over the top considering that time period included X-mas break and several snow days. While it’s obviously a high priority to you it probably wasn’t at the top of the to-do list for HCPS.
Why are you letting your kid wear budweiser shirts?
And people wonder why most high school kids drink at least occasionally…and the parents are always the last ones to know (usually they only find out when the police bust a high school party and call everyone’s parents to come pick up their drunk kids.)
DW—I have a feeling from reading other posts that you are involved in law enforcement. This is off the topic of this article, but could you please tell me why police officers simply call parents (who usually don’t punish their kids)? It would be best to at least ensure that the underage partiers be required to attend a scary and inconvenient drug and alcohol class. Can they be forced to do that without being arrested? I hope you know that almost all of the kids sent home with parents don’t learn a thing other than they can get away with what they’re doing. I’m curious about why things are handled the way they are.
Parents…they’re drinking in your house with their friends when you’re home because you assume they would never do such a thing. And they aren’t drinking Bud.
On the same side note I found the articles in the local print rag about the parties being busted with lots of beer on the premises in the parents upstairs sleeping funny in the sense that those parents expected people to believe they really didn’t know. of course it is more ironic the rest of the kids parents are clueless.
Lynn, yes I am in law enforcement. The reason why we just call the parents is because spending literally hours writing juvenile citations and then the hours spent in juvenile court as result (which would be all OT) are a waste of resources. The police can’t force kids to attend any sort of drug/alcohol classes. A judge can, but the only way they’ll get in front of a judge is if they’re charged, and quite frankly the juvenile justice system is a joke especially for stuff like alcohol violations. They get a slap on the wrist, maybe a couple hours community service, and probably some alcohol classes (which judging from the number of repeat DUI offenders I’ve arrested, alcohol classes aren’t overly effective.) It’s a waste of our time and resources to write 20 or so citations at every underage party we get called to. Those parties tie up at least 2 officers, sometimes more until they’re able to clear from the scene which leaves large portions of the county without police coverage.
The parents need to be parents. If they like getting called at 3 am to pick up their drunk son or daughter from a party and do nothing about it when they get home then unfortunately there is little the police can do to change behaviors. Kids know even if they do get arrested and charged with something most of the time they get a slap on the wrist, the case gets dropped, etc once it hits juvenile court. Those kids frequently are in for a rude awakening when they turn 18 (or when they finally commit a serious enough crime that they gets waived to adult status) and get taken to the jail instead of the precinct.
When we find parents who supply the alcohol to their kids and kids’ friends that’s a different story. They can be arrested on a variety of charges.
well if that’s the case. than maybe your child should be home schooled? I’m an actual student at HHS, and if you find THIS material offensive? than you would LOVE to hear what goes around in the hallways of an actual high school. I’m sure you can remember, i mean you were a teenager once before. But even a parent with strong feelings such as yourself has to agree, this was completely blown out of proportion. i mean honestly? forming a group dedicated to stop of a small high school of 700 people from viewing kids on stage?
If no one is studying the classics and learning the “creative process” through the eyes of “fantasy” writers whose works have endured for hundreds of years, who is going to be writing the “fantasy world stories” to equal or surpass Shakespeare, Tennyson, Dickens, Alcott, Barrett-Browning, or for that matter even Walt Disney and the like, in our children’s future? If “teaching” time is dedicated to perpetuating the “normal” of today, we’ll be reading nothing but multiple versions of “Teenagers in Angst and Ugliness” for the rest of our lives. The opportunities afforded in studying “fantasy” world literature far outweigh the perpetuation of vulgarities and inappropriateness found in the hallways of the high school by bringing it into the classroom. If nothing else is gained, the escape of reading about “fantasy” worlds in fine literature and theatre certainly allows for a removal from the stresses today’s teenagers face. I look forward to this matter bringing the focus back to enforcement of HCPS policies as they have already been written. The policies in place, if properly and diligently applied, more than amply address the matters that have been brought up throughout this “blog”. There are policies and procedures that are already in place that, had they been followed properly in this case, would have precluded this entire matter.
I agree that our students are faced with these and other “real” situations everyday, but I am unfamilair with the content of the program. Howevr, I do agree that it is unfair to REQUIRE the entire student body to view the program, especially without the option to sit out or attend a study hall type area while the rest of the students, who choose to, view the assembly.
The fact that many of the plays are student written is also a concern. Although a great class project, these individuals are not professionals, yet, and their material may not be suitable for or written and developed in a way that is appropriate for high school and even younger audiences (who attend by choice, I a aware!.)
I am curious if the administration does indeed approve ahead of time the material to be presented at Drama Therapy, the way they are supposed to do for other material (not previously approved by the county) that we are presenting to or using with our students?
I do not ignore the fact that something like this could indeed be helpful for those students who are struggling with these very difficult issues. There will always be a parent or parents upset about something that a teacher or school does because of its impact on their child, however, the real focus here is on the students, and if the students are not “outraged” by this year’s Drama Therapy, then why are others? Perhaps the administration and those involved in the production of the program should poll the students for thier thoughts in assessing the usefulness of appropriateness of the Drama Therapy program?
freedom of choice goes for all parties concerned…used to work just fine…but ‘we the people’ legislated all manner of common sense out of the fold.
First, I want to say that this whole thing has gotten way out of hand. Parents forming a group to go to the board to complain about this,sending emails,calling the school system, writing and sending letters to the press etc….(I did not even know about this sight,daggerpress, until today). The kids are not even that upset about this….its the parents that are pressing this…and now causing a lot of conflict amoungst students.If you are on here complaining…then you are a member of the PTA?attend school meetings regularly?Check Edline?Know your childs teacher?
That being said;I find the television set much more of a influence on our children then this Drama Therapy. I understand how maybe some of the information hit a “sensitivity cord” with some of you-but come on parents…is your kid on the internet??? Cause if they are;you are putting your energy in the wrong place. This program has been going on for years…and not to worry…Im sure you all have caused the cancellation of this whole “Drama Therapy” for the future. Because I am sure that the faculty and staff have had enough of this torture. I feel so sorry for them..because I am so sure they had the best of intentions…and you all have ruined it.If I was a teacher, I would work my 7-4 and call it a day-because trying to go “outside the box” and do some meaningful teaching-meant nothing.
This is all about the content and nothing but the content.If it wasn’t, no one would be on here….including myself…writing replys to people that want to keep every difficult and uncomfortable subject hidden from there children. Believe me when I say….they have seen and heard much worse.
Let the schools do there job. Let the employees teach…let your students learn and experience life. Let them figure out what they like,dont like and what they are willing to watch and not watch. You have raised them to this point…didnt you do a great job? Of course you did….let them grow and appreciate you-by letting them fly a little bit.Kids arent perfect…but mistakes help you learn.How many of you parents grew up in the 70’s….in the 80’s-we survived growing up…so will they!Our parents did not shield us from life…it will be OK.
When they graduate, you wont be there…you wont be there to screen every video they watch or every college lesson that is taught. Are you planning on attending college with them too?
Interesting you point that out, the college thing. I had a friend who found out that they don’t even have access to their kids college records!
Why should they? College kids are usually 18 or older and are technically adults even if their parents are paying for college.
My son, had to sign a note giving his parents permission to receive his grades. He did it willingly of course…but I think thats the sign of adulthood really starting. Thats why I so belive that once your kid hits high school…you really need to back off…like reviewing everything they see. The fact that thses kids came home to discuss with parents what they saw in Drama Therapy…what they liked…what they didn’t-that is a teaching time at work. Parents could have a nice talk with their kids on what they saw and what they are willing to value or not; out of Drama Therapy. Instead, people got all bent out of shape because their kids heard about things they see on TV and the internet everyday…. Instead of going to the board about this, maybe fight over the HCPS employees getting a 2% pay cut next year. Yes, your nurses,custodians, teachers and paraeducators will be cut 2%…when they already are making very little. Fight for that!
In that respect getting a script is good. So the parent who didn’t see it gets a frame of reference. Perhaps that is Mrs. Tates motive. Based on others comments thought that is not it. Remember when you send them to college they will have to apply the values you taught them and instilled in them, even in the face of those who clearly have apposing values.
CDEV you should know all about FERPA with your job. The college isn’t allowed to give out information without the student giving permission. If your kid won’t give you information about his college records and you as a parent want them, that is between you and your child not the college. If you are paying, then I guess it is your right to cut them off if they don’t comply.
I know that I was enlightening based on a friends experience. This parent was a helicoptor parent and got indignate when they couldn’t call and get the info. They didn’t understand that their little baby is an adult and has a right to privacy from them. Sadly this kid flunked out and didn’t tell their parents out of fear of their hovering.
oh my gosh! ok look I was in DT, this was the FOURTH and thanks to you guys probably the LAST year!! Oh my gosh why bring this up..NOW!! ok and for the record IF YOU WERE ACTUALLY PAYING ATTENTION when the play “Drugs are Bad” was being performed, you would have realized that the kid DID NOT WANT and actually started REFUSING to do stuff ie. smoke weed, watch porn, drink, etc. so WAKE UP!! And another thing, WHAT DO YOU THINK IS TALKED ABOUT IN HIGH SCHOOL?? I mean I walk down the hallway EVERY DAY..and i dont no how many times i hear someone sayin stuff about sex, drugs, cussing, etc. Its out there!!! Do you really expect us to sugar-coat it? They’ll fall asleep!! So, just like chill, unless you’re gonna hold your 20 year old son’s hand and walk him to his college classes and make sure he doesnt say any “bad words!!”
I totally agree with you…and I am a parent of an HHS student. All of us are not in agreement with the few…who want to try and shield the young adults of HHS of life and situations that are sometimes difficult. I am sure you are correct with this being the last year of Drama Therapy-but dont worry I am sure something else the school does will come up that bothers them. Your teachers will probably need a kind word from you this week;because I am certain this has been difficult for all of them at HHS.
i Definitely agree with this completely. its not like we were sending off mixed signals to students. the whole play “drugs are bad” was misconstrued. the play was meant to say that these items, videos, etc. are BAD. but of course some person had to misconstrue it and say “well they SAID porn, weed, and other bad things? my kids shouldnt know about that?” well odds are your kid ALREADY knows about that, and maybe if you look a BIT deeper into the play you would realize that were discouraging those items. but some people are stubborn. i know that with acting you cant appeal to the entire crowd. but i mean seriously? its HHS its not exactly the biggest school in the county. yet we are making the BIGGEST deal out of the SMALLEST issue…
WHY can’t people read? It is stated numerous times! There is not a problem with the content of Drama Therapy. It was along the lines of the same content always shown. The difference was that one of the performances had a slightly more dramatic ending that was scary, unnerving, etc. Some students were bothered due to past experiences, personal reasons, etc. When the parents heard, they started asking questions and the school stonewalled.
I do not see a problem with sending the consent forms home! GOD KNOWS the students get and have ALWAYS gotten tons of forms and letters from the school. Due to the fact this was a mandatory showing at the school there probably should have been something. People can say “students can fall asleep” or “they do not care.” However truth is that most of the students CANNOT fall asleep or even NOT pay attention because the teachers have been known to pentalize for it. It is common knowledge to the student body. The only ones who probably don’t know are the ones who didn’t care in the first place. Weither anyone likes it or not the performance during school hours was MANDATORY.
ANYWAYS! The problem is not with the material. Everyone points fingers at the parents and how they raise their kids. Bottom line is that everyone raises them differently, not all parents can come to EVERYTHING shown at the school, not ALL THINGS should be put into a consent form because these ARE high school students,and not all events at the high school are really explained or even known to the parents.
THE PROBLEM IS THE SCHOOL STONEWALLED. The school ignored a legit request from the parents about mandatory material shown to their kids and it is illegal. Hiding everything just made the problem worse because it makes it look like the school and the program had something to hide.
If the program ends (WHICH I HOPE NOT because it is a pretty good program (plus a lot of students get extra credit for going to the night performance) and it brings in money for the program) then it is the school’s fault.
The problem is not the content? Your dreaming…its all about the content. Kids came home, saying they were surprised about some of the content they saw at school(Drama Therapy)(the same kids who are on the internet & watch R movies etc).So the parents decided to get together because they want to be able to view everything their kids see. No one would have said a thing…if it wasnt about the content. The school put on this program before;but dont worry…it will not go on next year. I am sure the school has had enough with this subject.What about the kids that acted in the skits and wrote the material;how do you think they feel now? This is high school;not elementary and not middle school.By the way, we can read…we just know its about the content.
While I think the content is the driving force behind this, the fact that the parents are up in arms about is that they didn’t get the requested materials in what they considered a timely fashion. As CDev pointed out, given everything else that was going on the request was probably a fairly low priority. Had so much time gone by when X-mas break (winter break, whatever) and several snow days not been involved then I think there would be a basis for complaining about it.
If Drama Therapy completely ends, there will be a lot of students prepared to do something about it or just be plain ticked off. I know everyone that performed in that play. I know everyone that went to the night showings besides a large group of middle schoolers. A performance that included a gunshot scared the living crap out of people because it was not a typical drama therapy performance. However no one really knows how everyone would have reacted had the material just been shown, but since the school had hidden it the parents are ticked. Maybe Drama Therapy doesn’t have to end, maybe the guidance counselors and the parents can help be involved with it, and then if something has a possibility of bothering a group something can be sent out or the students can be warned. I’m not dreaming. I say the play too, but If you want more reactions like the member of the DT club fine. Otherwise maybe their should be some kind of discussion including everyone on what to do after everyone sees the tape.
There was also an article about the production in the Sun:
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/harford/bal-md.ha.drama05dec05,0,4954501.story
It was advertised…check the above and the date. Plus, it was also listed on the website and HCPS news. What else would you like a high school to do? Where were these parents during the last 4 years of Drama Therapy? You can’t say they are freshman, because the lady who started this; has a daughter who graduated last year. So this is not new. Look…the Drama Therapy skits were no different then the guy announcing that someone had died in a car accident and then announcing that it was all for reminding students about drinking and driving(Prom safety)…that happened last year and the year before. Where was the complaining then?Did they send out permission slips for that? Just let the teachers teach…and don’t shield students from real life situations.If I was the Principal, I would just say “Drama Therapy” is no more…cause this whole thing got so way out of hand.You want students to complain and guidance to become involved-if this goes towards canceling-no way..they have other jobs to do. Do you have any idea what goes into running a school;who in the world would put any more energy into this? Drama Therapy is now tainted;peoples feelings hurt-job well done I say(sarcastically.)
Anne…
My daughter was not shocked by the content, but that the administration allowed a school assembly about it. With everyone being so sue happy and seemingly protective over children’s supposed fragile egos she thought it was odd that the admin would allow the student body to view these topics discussed along with the foul language that was scattered through out it. If a freshman could see that there is the possibility of outrage, why couldn’t administrators?
As I said, I have no problem with it; the topics discussed in Drama Therapy. The problem is when no one can get the information to a parent who IS concerned and stonewalling them. 100% I do not buy that it was not initially about content, but it has turned into something bigger which is probably more concerning to Mrs. Tate. Forgetting about consent, if I want to see curriculum or material my child is being exposed to, I have that right. These HHS/HCPS officials discussed are flat out avoiding the situation…nothing but excuses. As a parent, that just isn’t good enough. I would hate to think that if i had a valid concern that I would be treated the same way Mrs. Tate has been.
Cyndi, Lets agree to disagree. Because, I choose to trust the school, trust professional teachers and trust the kids I have raised-that they can make wise decisions without my constant interfering. Since it was advertised in the Baltimore Sun,and HCPS website way in advance…maybe that was thought enough for them to inform “informed” parents. I just hope while you all are at the board complaining about this subject-that you remind the board about the 2% pay cut they are giving all HCPS employees next year. Between this Drama Therapy hoopla and a pay cut-you all got what you wanted;no drama therapy and no teaching “outside the box”. I will not be commenting further on any more of this subject.
As stated previously, the problem lies with Administration. In the apparent “stonewalling” of the concerned parents as well as in their limited involvement with the program and review/approval of the content to be performed.
If they did review and approve the skits/content then they should indeed step up and take responsibility for it! If they didn’t then perhaps this is a wake-up call for them to be more aware of what certain individuals within their school are doing!
In reading all of the above comments, it seems clear to me, at least, that the HHS and HCPS administration realize a mistake was made in making Drama Therapy a mandatory assembly. otherwise, why all the delay tactics? Like most matters, the controversy usually dies down fairly quickly because folks get tired of fighting. here, however, we have a parent who feels strongly enough to exercise her rights and not go away quietly.
GOOD FOR HER!! Whether you agree that this program was beneficial or not, Rachel Tate is to be admired for her courage and determination to exercise her constitutional rights, even in the face of such opposition.
I feel as though she is speaking on my behalf. We ALL have a threshold, as parents, where we will finally intervene, and this point is clearly different for each one of us. Many have no problem with this issue, but should the school system be allowed to teach more and more controversial topics without parental knowledge, every one of us would (or SHOULD) reach a point where we would get mad enough to get involved.
By holding HCPS administration ACCOUNTABLE on this point, we are insuring that parents stay actively involved in our children’s education in future matters. With all that our kids have to face in the world today, the most dangerous thing we can do is nothing.
Absolutely correct. Well said.
Just so everyone knows, the assembly is not mandatory.Sure it takes place during the school day, but no administrator at the school would force a student to go or stay if the student were to let them know they were uncomfortable with viewing the production.
This is ridiculous on so many levels. First, as a former student I was forced to attend the Drama Therapy plays and there is no content a high school student doesn’t know about. If you were worried about the content in these plays, your mind would be blown at the casual conversations that take place in schools. Also, the majority of students who go to the plays don’t pay attention. I’m not sure the leading factor, the bad acting or the idea you are being forced to go, but the plays are practically unbearable after the first time you watch them (they do a similar production each year). Finally, as others have said, if you were uncomfortable, you would have been able to leave.
I understand you were concerned about not knowing what was covered but trust me, your student has heard way worse from his/her friends.
HHS does a good job teaching the students not just the classroom esentials, but about life. They learn about community service, standing up for what’s right and how to be productive members of society. Drama Therapy is a multi-faceted event. It showcases that a group of young adults can work together as a team of not just actors and actresses; but playwrights,stage crew, and directors. They have done a great job over the years in dealing with topics that are a reality nad are harsh, but a re important to people at that age. They do this for no pay, no pat-on -the-back, just to put on a show that has some meaning. For the students whose parents don’t want them to attend, come pick them up that afternoon, or make arrangements for them to leave school and volunteer in the community. Other than that, try to find a more needing subject to harp on. the only thing that the school admin did not attend to well, is they should have sent home an event booklet,( that was available to all students), with instructions that the student go over it with a parent. If the student doesn’t have the responisibility to give it to their parents then it’s a parental problem. May Drama Therapy grow and be a usefull event for many years. Good Luck to them.
If I would have been told in advance about the content of the program I would have been more than happy to either pick my student up so as to miss it or not attend at night.
Again the point is missed
NO PARENTAL NOTIFICATION BEFORE HAND
YOU COULD HAVE GONE AND SEEN THE PLAY THE NIGHT BEFORE IT WAS PERFROMED IN SCHOOL!!!!
If you surveyed high school students and asked them how many papers they actually take home and give their parents to read, you would find out there aren’t very many. I myself wouldn’t give my parents every single newsletter the school handed out since middle school unless it needed to be signed and brought back.
Also in the programs for Drama Therapy it gives a brief summary of what each play is about, if a student didn’t feel comfortable watching a certain play, went to a teacher and said something, that they would not be forced to sit there and watch it.
I have seen all the drama therapy shows and of them, this year has been my favorite, the actors were brilliant, the plays were well written and i feel that they had even more of an impact written by fellow students/alumini than anyone else. Which also brings me to the point of, you can sit there and talk about these things with your kids or even watch tv and movies about these topics, but when classmates are up there performing the skits your going to get more out of it. And they say it plenty throughout the whole show if they know anyone or need to talk to someone the guidance office is always there. Whether or not these things happen to people you know or don’t know they still happen.
Well I wasn’t given parental notification that the Chorus would be singing spiritual or religious songs during the FORCED assemblies either! Given that the constitution guarantees a separation of church and state…I could protest loudly!! This isn’t about parental notification at all!! This is about one parent that wants their children to have a religious education in a public school setting and has bandwagoned a few parents to force a watered down education. Many of the parents blasting the school on this issue have children that are far from perfect. People should be very careful throwing rocks, they might find their own windows get broken! This has caused dissension amongst the children of the complaining parents and those students who support Drama Therapy. Eventually when adults exhibit bad behavior, children take their example. I envision some of those complaining parents finding out the harsh realities of things their own little angels are doing out of their presence!
It is easy to back someone you call a friend, its harder to stand up and go against a friend! It’s called independent thinking…some of you should try it! Just because Rachel Tate is your friend does not mean she is right on THIS issue.
Both Christine and Rachel Tate have children that have graduated that have seen Drama Therapy for the last 2 to 3 years…there are NO secrets about what is going on at Drama Therapy. Why haven’t they asked for the scripts before, demanded parental consent for their older daughters? Drama Therapy is discussed by those children for weeks and weeks as the preparations are made. Any parent that didn’t know about it is plain negligent!
Any parent that is involved (truly involved) with their children will tell you that Mr. & Mrs. Cummins are among a handful of truly caring teachers at HHS!!! There was NEVER a time that I sent an email or phoned either with an issue that they weren’t truly there for me or my children!! They have given parents their home phone number and cell to get ahold of them if the situation presented itself. No matter how big or small an issue a child goes to the Cummins and they are met with a sympathetic ear and sent away with a solution or a path to a solution. They both teach out of the box and I have NEVER heard a student say anything negative about them. Even when they didn’t agree with the solution that they were provided.
Please allow me to voice my opinion….I understand the frustration of Mrs.tate and the other concerned parents…A “opt-form” should of been a choice for these parents and students however….I was privy to see the PRE-PERFORMANCE work of these Drama Therapy students…There was alot of hard work and LOTS of conversation amonst the students in regards to these different SKITS and even though some of the content was of a mature nature the bottom line it opend up a line of communication amongst these students with their fellow peers and believe it or not talking is part of HEALING and DEALING and for all we know the THERAPY part may have been very present amongst them.Lets face it some kids who may have been subjected to some of the content these skits portaryed may have actually started their road to HEALING and DEALING just by performing and did not have to do the uncomfortable step of talking to a PROFESSIONAL..Victims are usually very reluctant to talk about painful things that have happened to them so maybe just maybe this was a form of therapy for some.So again I say I understand the parents view on all of this but lets us not forget the very words above the doors of HHS.
ENTER TO LEARN
LEAVE TO SERVE
So closiing a painful memory that may of happened to one will allow an individual to become a more confident and productive ADULT and as a result they will be successful leaving the school with that goal in mind
as said before these plays have been going on for like 4 years. i dont see why parents are freaking out that they “didnt get notification” before hand. Everyone knows about the topics. Its been out there for everyone and also your students could have told you parents what was going on. Dont you talk to your children about whats going on at school? You would have known if you actually talked to them. Plus all the students at school know what dramatherapy is about because mr cummins has been talking about it since the beginning of the year. repeatedly!I cant seem to understand why all of sudden dramatherapy is such an issue. the plays have been about the same topics since its been started. But i do think that from now on,maybe a letter could be sent home to the parents about dramatherapy from now on, so things like this dont happen again… this is honestly getting stupid that people are still going on and on about this. seriously this is over with. and even if u did get the scripts and videos what would that do? its not going to change what the students already saw.
While I realize that yes, the outrage expressed is slightly premature, it gives no one the right to smash a school or school system because they were doing what they felt was right.
The Drama Therapy assembly was required, yes. But parents wouldn’t be angry or upset if HHS administration required students to attend an assembly for the Spring Musical. While I agree that HHS should have allowed access to the content, the argument is now no longer necessary. Parents had an opportunity to watch the original, unedited DVD of the production last night.
Honestly, there is nothing wrong with pushing the envelope a little bit. How will a student talking one-on-one with a guidance counselor publicly embarrass the student or the students family? Honestly, I think that high school students have become adept at hiding reactions, therfore there is no reason to believe that people will find out about a students personal life unless that student chooses to share the information.
I enjoy participating in Drama Therapy and think it’s helpful to students who not only watch the show, but also to those who participate. My freshman year, i had a cpl of friends before Drama Therapy. Now, I have a family that consists of everyone I met then, and have met since.
Also, if students are given an opt-out choice, couldn’t it be assumed that somehow or other they will get themselves into that auditorium? They won’t want to stay in a classroom and have to work when their friends are in the auditorium just chilling. And I don’t think any teacher will want to stay and watch them. If a parent doesn’t want his or her child attending the assembly, than they should keep their child home from school that day.
Honestly, i don’t understand what the whole problem is? do you want creativity in our students? do you want our kids to hold in their issues, and later on let them out regrettably? is that what you want? I’m a student at a high school, and i know the drama that goes on. you think THIS is bad? you have no clue what goes on in school. if parents are so “concerned” about their grasp on parenthood with their children, then they shouldn’t be worried about some high school drama production. they should be worried about their kids actual education.
i find it so stupid that this has become such a big deal. were acting like little kids about this entire situation. ITS JUST A HIGH SCHOOL DRAMA PRODUCTION! and i know your probably all thinking that your knowledge surpasses mine because, hey, I’m just a high school kid? i don’t know what I’m talking about? but I’m having way more common sense about the situation than any parents are having at the moment. it frustrates me how much attention this has gotten. give the kids a break? how many other high schools do you see even trying to address these heart breaking issues? i don’t see any? this is the only high school production that actually focuses on the WHOLE PICTURE. they’re not trying to put on a show? they’re not trying to make kids feel insecure. They’re trying to HELP KIDS, and if you have a problem with that. maybe you should question your own thoughts of the rights of citizens, the rights of freedom of speech, right to petition. (if it ties into this in any way?) they’re not hurting anybody by doing this are they? if they are PLEASE tell me, i would LOVE to listen…
also, the assembly was NOT mandatory! the kids could have left if the content was too uncomfortable.
i attended the meeting last night and saw the production. it was pretty shocking. certainly a violation of the school of conduct and the county policies. the 60% of show that was funny or just plain good, was more than offset by the 40% that was appalling. kids are not at fault, Mr. Cummins should probably be fired or transferred, principal Walling should be disciplined and Volrath just plain dropped the ball as far as how he handled the situation when the parents started calling. it was acknowledged that it was scheduled during school time, was mandatory. be on the look out for the next showing as you should see for yourself what occurred.
I’m just curious since I don’t know anything about the content except what’s been posted on here, what in the play was in violation of county policy?
I saw the production and will give you a few lines that I found the most offensive. As an aside to the student who thinks some of us parents are so clueless, I was raped when I was teenager and I can say with 100% certainty that this type of performance would not have drawn me out of my silence. It probably would have had the opposite effect. If you really do know someone that was sexually assaulted, I would strongly encourage you get them to SARC.
Probably the line that was the most troubling was the sister telling her mentally disturbed sister who had been raped by her drunk boyfriend that “I’m not paying for your abortion – I’ll give it to you myself.” She also told the sister that no one would believe anything she said and that people would just she was crazy. The girl shot herself later on. It was very disturbing on many levels.
Second, foul language like “god da__”, “prude bitch” and few other words not allowed by the FCC. Talking about sexcapades, a girl who had sex with 8 guys last year. Then there were conversations (after playing a drinking game on stage)about making out with strangers, going skinny dipping, girls kissing girls and other topics which led to a confession about incest.
Hopefully you might understand why parents would be upset that their 14 year old students (or any others) would be mandated to attend this assembly. Whether or not students talk about these things or do them is irrelevant, and if parents have no problem with their kids seeing it then fine. TV stations have to put in disclaimers before certain shows (for Mature audiences) and movies have ratings to alert parents about adult content so no one should be questioning any parent who had strong concerns about the DIALOGUE and/or content in some of these skits.
For the students themselves, I agree they aren’t to blame and the idea of students presenting their own material is a great one. I thought many of the “Check Please” skits were very funny and some of the others too so I don’t want any of the students to think this is a gripe against them.
Thanks for the response. Thus far it’s the only one I’ve read that actually gives specifics on what was offensive and I can understand why some parents would be upset by it. The topics covered I think are fine, though some of that is just ridiculous (specifically the bit about the girl and her sister who got raped by her drunk boyfriend.) The foul language wouldn’t bother me as I unfortunately hear it on a daily basis from young children through senior citizens I know most high school students use it at least occasionally (and many use it frequently when talking with their friends.)
As a police officer, I certainly second your recommendation of SARC. I can’t even guess how many women I’ve referred to SARC (mostly from domestics) and I’ve spoken to several women who have gotten help SARC and they all had a positive experience (though regrettably they all were either back with their original abuser or with a different one which why I was speaking to them.)
hey madatory , get a life , or better, go do something that the kids at HHS are instructed on and shown the benefits of. Helping the community, helping their peers and being a well balanced adult with a sense of reality. Obviously you have nothing better to do but bash the teacher ,the writers and the actors. please go do something more usefull, if you know how.
Your disrespect to someone who is obviously a parent and most likely in a position to receive the most modest elements of respect further illustrates your ignorance of the matter. Just because you are able to be anonymous in this forum does not entitle you to be so derogatory. The majority of the discussion here has been civil and respectful, if a little dismissive of other’s opinions, and only the obviously “under 21” set has been as hateful and obdurate in their defense of adults who have let their students down. You need to learn what is an appropriate response and how to properly word it, including grammer, puncutation, capitalization, and spelling. Only when you can compose a sensibly written, and respectful reply, that is truly pertinent to the conversation at hand should you take part in it. If you are unable to do so, you should just sit back and observe until you can.
I’ll take the under 21 for someone who is over 40, College educated and working in a professional position. AS for your opinion here that most of the discussion has been respectful I would beg to differ. I have been reading a lot of flack thrown at the former students that wrote several of the pieces ( o- they are in college continuing their education, wow), the actors/actresses who worked hard and put on the event, and Mr. Cummins who has doen an outstanding job of choosing topics that are REVELANT and REALITY grounded to do something that far to often does not happen; which is deal with this thing called life. Drama Therapy is about that, no sugar coating, and put on in a way to encourage the students to examine themselves, their habits and their surroundings. is it edgy, yes. Good; far to often parents and schools send students out to the world and they cannot deal with pressure, failure or the realities that hit them. Thanks to Drama Therapy; Mr. Cummins and the HHS staff for effort. May it become a example and astandard around the state. Lastly, thanks Mr. Gates, spell & grammer check have eroded the skills I was taught at HHS many years ago, need to brush up.
Dear Go Rachel Tate!
I’d rather hear from the kids we’re discussing than your condescending comments. How superior you sound, how very ignorant too-
Freedom of speech is the phrase, not freedom of perfectly grammatical speech.
Just because you can put down the system and young folks with words like “obdurate” doesn’t give you the right to silence ANYONE. If you don’t like the content of what they’re saying, counter it with logic- don’t stoop to pointing out grammatical errors- this certainly isn’t the forum for “proper writing”.
And YOU talk about others being dismissive?? Your age is showing- the year is 2010.
And for the record? Much ado about nothing- if we’d spend half as much energy supporting public education-
One More Former Student nails it- “Helping the community, helping their peers and being a well balanced adult with a sense of reality”- Go HHS!
Respect is earned NOT given. Try respecting these kids expression and they might respectfully listen to what you have to say, even if they disagree with it. When you treat these young adults like you and others on here do, you show that you are in fact no more mature then the immaturity you attribute to them.
FYI you should not lecture someone else about grammar until you can spell the word correctly!
I attended the view of the DVD last night. I stand firm behind my convictions that the content was not appropriate for all students without notification beforehand. A 14 yr old student does not have the same maturity level and brain development as a 17 or 18yr old and the teachers and administrators know this.
80% of the show was fine. It was funny and well put together. I am duly impressed with the acting and production abilities of HHS teenagers.
The program was described by a DT member who was there as “to reach students and show them that it is okay to talk about things that may be bothering them because others deal with it too”
That in itself is a very good thing. If that was and always is the intention of the students then Bravo. However, I told Mr. Volraith and Ms Walling last night that the ending of “it is 2:00pm the buses are waiting hurry and get out of here” is not appropriate.
What if the DT group reached someone that needed help and they had no other way to get home other than the bus?
I as an adult (not a student) am so upset by the administration that I was not able to sleep last night. I can not say anymore.
There is something terribly wrong with governmental and parental interference in basic education.
When I went to school there was no such thing as a PTA, there were no administrators apart from the headmaster’s secretary, we had a school nurse and a handyman. Our school buildings were built circa 1705.
We were at school to be educated, and most of our teachers were expert at disseminating information, our examinations were designed (and hand marked) to ensure we had grasped that information.
Now we have an out of control monster; a whole bureaucracy exists in HCPS, much of which spends time on non value exercises like rebutting parental criticism, creating impractical (and often ill advised) curricula, and consequently costing us more than 50% of our county’s budget.
Teachers should be left alone to do what they trained for and were employed to do. If they fail, it should be the responsibility of the head teacher to correct this issue, not the HCPS or the PTA.
While we sit around agonizing over whether students should see the President’s speech, or if the content of a school play was acceptable, you are slowly but surely reducing the role of an educator to a level that means there will never be any valuable applicants.
Teachers are at ground zero; they hear the scoop, they know what is on a child’s mind, they know, far better than the average parent, what a child should be exposed to.
Even the children have a better idea of “what is appropriate” – most parents have no idea what their children discuss with their peers.
Please leave the schools alone, they are trying to educate your children and prepare them for the real world. Spend your time reducing the faceless bureaucracy, thereby saving us all taxes.
I take serious exeption to your “parental interference” comment. You are so unbelievably arrogant that you think you know better than me what is right for my children? What has happened to the parent- teacher partnership? Only half of my childs learning happens in school, I teach the other half. You want me to blindly let teachers, some with less education and qualifications than me, have carte blanche with my childs mind? No, No ,No. I pay your salary, and don’t you ever forget it.
Just putting it out there for all DT students and supporters: PLEASE be careful and not make others look bad for your hurtful or immature comments. As a member of DT, I come and read these comments that some have posted and am shocked at how personal these comments are becoming towards the Tate family. Some attcks, which are completely unrelated and unnessasary are ruining the reputation of DT students and the program. So please, once again, keep the bashing and rude comments to a minimum. thanks
or not at all.
I would much rather have parents ticked about the material then to shoulder the burden of a dead kid from drugs, drinking, and suicide. I would rather kids know the truth about incest, premarital sex and child abuse then to have that repeated in every generation.
Now, Rachel is right: The school admin screwed up. They didn’t send out information on the show. However, I don’t believe that permission should be sought if the program is done correctly with counselor services provided. Why? Simple answer: Perpetrators who commit abuse and drug pushers who need to have kids making “that score” would LOVE to see programs that caution against physical and drug/alcohol abuse canceled.
I stand behind Rachel 100% about the administration end of it. I, however, do not agree with changing the program in anyway. You need to reach the core audience – those that are neglected, abused, thinking about having sex, those that are raped/molested by family and family friends, etc. Again, I would rather have the anger of parents then the death of a child. I would rather have to tell my child the truth then to attend a funeral for someone that has committed suicide because we want to live in a fantasy world.
I have openly stated that I do not agree with how the Administration treated DT. HHS has always taught all students to stand up for others and what they believe it.
That said , I am shocked that the Student Body of HHS are so shallow and immature as to ostracize the children of any Parents who choose to voice a different opinion.
DT staff and students have stated that they wanted to make a positive difference at the school and with their peers. What happened to tolerance of others opinions and allowing people to stand up for what they believe it.
Every person at HHS who treats a child differently because of this should be ashamed of themselves
Amen, Christina. But then, this could be a learning experience for the kids. Let’s hope, right?
Ok i have been sort of following this whole ordeal. and i came to one conclusion about both the content and the parents right to be notified of the content and have it readily available to them.
As for the content it is what it is. it was real, it was raw, and it is what happens every single day all over the world not just in our own corner of Harford county. opening the minds of our youth and preparing as best as possible for the world isn’t that one of the jobs being a teacher? it just so happens Mr.Cummins has his own methods of doing so. it offends some it does not offend some but the point being in that whats done is done… period end of story. time to move on.
As for parent notification and access to material… this itself was faulty on behalf of the admin but then again i don’t think the admin really anticipated this kind of unrest and was trying to save face.
All in all i think it time to stop beating a dead horse and move one. i feel all of this attention on miss tate and her family and on hhs is unwarranted.
To Go Rachel Tate,
Who the hell do you think you are? How dare you be so condesending and think that you are so high and mighty that you feel that you can talk to ppl in this manner. You hide behind a fake name atleast I have enough gall to write my own freaking name. Maybe since you hide behind the fake name you might not really be all the supportive of Mrs.Tate’s cause but it seems to me that you must be friends and you need to show her that you are with her…Sounds like you are a NON-INDEPENDENT THINKER……Grow up
Well said Lisa, that was uncalled for her to even say something like that. 🙂
If parents knew how hard these kids worked for putting this production on then they would see how much time they put into it. There was never a joke about it, each actor provided reasons and ways to get out of each situation (pregnancy,raping,drunk driving) There was never a line that supported ANY of these issues… This problem has been BLOWN UP OUT OF PROPORTION. Parents know that these plays have been presented for the past 3-4 years and there was never a issue about passing out slips for approval to see them… Mr.Cummins is a great man and he would never do anything to hurt anyone. If these plays have greatly disturbed you then you shouldn’t of never showed up because NO child was forced to participate.
Just to add something to make a point…
For ‘Go Rachel Tate author, you have just insulted every child/adult who has a learning disablity in your comment that I responded to. How does this make you feel? Are you justified in making these comments? How do you know that you were not speaking to someone who has a LD. It is ppl like you who have no respect for another human being and put themselves on a pedal stool and think they are better then anyone …You may have grammar skils but your personal skills are so far off the wall that you look like a moron.
“Mr. and Mrs. Cummins are wonderful.” They probably are, but wonderful and good sense do not always go hand in hand. It doesn’t matter if the past few years of DT performances were “wonderful.” If this year was not OK (and the double victimization of a mentally challenged child by an acquaintance and family member and subsequent suicide certainly sounds like it meets the criteria) and inappropriate, then past year successes cannot be called upon to make this year right. The lack of common sense was most likely present then as well, the Cummins just got lucky with content. Parents are called upon to/praised for partnering with the school and being involved until there is a problem then–they are interfering and should butt out.
If the production cannot bear the light of day (i.e. scripts and unaltered video provided to anyone who asks at any time) then parents can and should make the inference that what was presented was completely inappropriate–not suitable for minor aged young adults. Mr. Cummins and Principal Wallings certainly are aware of the age of their students. The level of sophistication of students is not a generalization HCPS staff should make. Given that the school personnel stated the point of DT productions is to bring issues forward, lack of parental notification doesn’t allow parents to even know what questions to ask their kids when they came home that night. How does that work with “parents should keep in tune/know their kid?” And as it was stated that every high school student attended, how cruel was it to have special education students watch someone with their label being horribly victimized to the point that the individual felt it necessary to commit suicide? These students would not likely independently decide it wasn’t something they wanted to see and leave–for them it would be mandatory–they go where they are told. Did anyone talk to those students after the show? Obviously the parents didn’t know, and quite possibly their children wouldn’t know how to articulate what they saw. In real life, when a student accidentally/tragically dies, there are counselors made available to the students. Students with disabilities–my child being one of them–often have problems differentiating between real and make believe. With HCPS staff taking a “this is overblown” dismissive stance, have they really tried to find out?
How sad. These people at the very least need alot more supervision.
Dear SadParent,
Please conact me at hcpsconcernedparents@hotmail.com. I would certainly appreciate a more developed conversation with you.
Ok – a resolution was found already. Enough is truly enough, folks. People are not debating any more – they are demeaning. Little eyes are watching what we are saying and what we are doing. What are you showing them? For all the good that drama therapy can do it is all lost in the behavior of all of us and what we are displaying. And frankly, a lot of us should be absolutely ashamed of our behavior. You can debate and be passionate without being sarcastic, hateful and harmful. We wonder why children behave as they do? Take a look at the actions of the adults. For those of Faith, go read Psalm 46:10. For those that just want to have something say and be argumentative and hateful (on BOTH sides of this issue), go ahead and do your damage. Eventually no one will listen to you.
After previewing the HCPS meeting I must say that I find somethings very troubling about those parents that are commenting here!
Christine Kane (who has posted on here) stated that she always allows her children including her middle school student to go to high school functions “with out parents breathing down their necks”. So this means she who is a friend of the Tates KNEW before the in school viewing the content as she stated that both her middle school and high school children attended the Dec. 3rd event! If she interacted with her children and they were SO traumatized by the viewing surely as a friend she would have called Rachel before the assembly in school the next day. She said she always allows her children to go to high school events “because they are safe” but “Thursday night it was not safe”. She goes on to state that the school should have sent her notification to not send her 12 year old daughter. Since when does the school become responsible for her decisions as a parent? She made a conscious decision as a parent to allow her 12 year old daughter to attend a function geared towards high school students! And she made that decision because she doesn’t want to breath down their neck! She has had a daughter graduate who has attended the last 3 years, if she had truly interacted with her children, then there was no surprises!
Rachel Tate states that she “has NO problem with what you did” (speaking directly at Mark Cummins). She goes on to state she has a problem with the school board and administration. She then says her children tried to tell her about the Dramatherapy production but she said “it wasn’t clicking with her and she went on to do something else”. Really was it so devastating that she ignored them and went on to do something else??? That had me completely and utterly amazed! She goes on to say it wasn’t until a friend called her to ask if her children were okay that she realized what was going on. She then goes on to say that if her child had been asked to perform in the production that she would have been prepared. She then goes on to say that people are posting on Facebook and Daggerpress hate speech about her family, because of the boards failure to do their job! What she failed to mention is that she and her family are attacking anyone that doesn’t agree with her views.
Justine Cerrutos mother was the most credible person who spoke, as a parent she speaks of how she and her daughter discussed Dramatherapy long before the show. She herself also is the parent of a special needs child. She was present at the production and believes that the content was viable to help raise awareness. She is an involved parent in her childrens education. She doesn’t do Monday night quarterbacking. As a parent if we are involved we don’t have to Monday night quarterbacking!
As a former HHS student I am in full support of the Cummins’, the guidance counselors, and the students who put such hard work into the DT plays.
However, referring to the issues of “It was mandatory” and “It’s not about the content”, I have some opinions of my own. Please forgive me if these things were already stated. The constant back and fourth between a few key people who chose to voice their opinions became annoying.
I know of at least two other programs, not related to the school’s curriculum, that also produce mandatory assemblies. Both of which I feel were not a benefit to my education. One is the school’s pep rally. I’m sure none of the parents that are upset about their child being forced to go to the DT assembly would be upset when their child is forced to go to the pep ralley. I personally did not like going to the pep rallies because I’d like to believe that a pep rally is supposed to be a celebration of the ENTIRE student body, yet many groups were left unrepresented, leaving only glorification to the athletes.
A second assembly was the “Cultural Awareness” Assembly. I felt that this was a program that was rather biased, and if you’ve attended HHS you may know what I mean. Also, if I felt like raising a stink I could go into how the program dangerously infringes on seperation of church and state.
I find it difficult to understand that many of Havre de Grace’s residents take pride that they are part of a very art orientated city, yet many at the same time jump all over productions like this. Maybe their definition of “art” is unfortunately limited.
The arts are endangered in public schools, and I would be quite sad to see them go, or reduced to mindless “safe, clean, and happy” renditions of Disney’s “High School Musical”.
My point is that this controversy is ALL about the content of DT. If it wasn’t about that, I would expect to see a few parents also questioning why their children had been forced to attend the two other mandatory assemblies. If one assembly is deemed to be optional, all of them should.
AndAnotherFormerStudent …you forgot to mention the Band and Choral assemblies where gospel and spiritual songs are played and sang! Every concert has multiple instances of this. Prayer is a nono and they took the word God out of the pledge….then there should be NO religious music allowed at these mandatory assemblies!!! But even those parents that find it offensive do not object, because most of us believe in tolerance! I for one do not object to my children learning different cultures and beliefs, because they are young adults formulating their own opinions. It just seems that a select few want to impose their beliefs on the children of HDG and lord forbid if you disagree with them! It is one thing to share your beliefs quite another to ram it down their throats!
Actually God was not inserted in the Pledge until the 50’s
As I read the law in regards to this topic it is apparent that Havre de Grace High School did in fact VIOLATE the LAW! This is not a matter of free speech or any other lame excuses that I see listed here in these posts. The simple fact is that Congress enacted the Hatch Amendment of 1984/PPRA. The Hatch Amendment passed in 1984 allows parents the right to opt out their children if the school made use of experimental or values-related classes that depart from academics. The Hatch Amendment stated that the parents have the right to examine and inspect all instructional material, including that used in experimental or testing programs. Unless parental consent is given, no student shall be required to submit to any kind of test designed to reveal information of a non-academic nature. Know what your child is being exposed to in school! This production had no academic value, departed from academics all together, and therefore consent slips should have gone home because the exposure of its content falls under this act. There was no effort made by HHS to allow parents to have their kids opt out of this production. It is very apparent that HHS and the board is stonewalling as mentioned before. HHS you are wrong and need to comply with the law. Parents you need to know your rights as it deals with your kids education. Secondly, The Supreme Court has time and time again affirmed the well established principle that parents possess a right to control the upbringing of their children. The Congress, in 1978, sought to protect parental rights when they enacted the “Protection Of Pupil’s Rights Act (PPRA)” sometimes referred to as the Hatch Amendment. The PPRA permits parents to inspect classroom materials. Additionally many states have laws granting parents the right to remove their children from certain courses, typically sex or health education courses. A parent’s right to remove a child from objectionable classroom instruction and activity is grounded in three constitutional provisions:
The Fourteenth Amendment Due Process Law and the First Amendment Free Speech and Free Exercise Clause.
The following are the Laws Provisions and Amendments on which this right is based:
The potential scenarios faced by Christian parents typically fall into two basic categories; those that involve some degree of student coercion and those that involve mere “exposure” to objectionable or offensive ideas. There is a strong constitutional argument under the Fourteenth Amendment, that parents, and only parents, have the right to direct their children’s moral, ethical, and religious development. The claim of Christian parents that school curricula has infringed their right under the due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment to control the education of their children is derived from a line of significant Supreme Court cases. When the challenged activity involves coercion, the First Amendment Free Speech Clause may offer the strongest argument against it. Whenever a student is forced to participate in a classroom activity or to embrace an opinion contrary to that student’s or his parent’s religious beliefs, constitutional issues immediately arise. The Free Exercise Clause provides another ground upon which parents can challenge not only coercion, but the mere exposure of school children to classroom instruction, material or activity that is hostile to their faith. Indeed it can be argued that exposure to offensive material, as opposed to forced participation in an activity, is simply a more subtle variety of coercion. The Free Exercise argument asserts that the school’s choice of certain instructional materials effectively indoctrinates school children with values and beliefs hostile to the family’s religious faith.
This was a mandatory school assembly, parents and students were not allowed to opt out under the PPRA rights, which is clearly a violation of the students and parents civil rights granted under law, this is a Constitutional violation here!!!!!! There was a violation of the parents Constitutional rights under the 14th Amendment. Wise up, do you think for one minute that the school board does not know this, they do and they are trying to protect themselves at this very moment, I know this to be a fact. (Insider Info)
Check out this website – http://americanheritagealliance.org/billofrights.htm
On a lighter note, anyone need an attorney!!!!!!
Based on your first ammendment arguement does a parent have the right to opt out of Physics because “they do not believe in gravity”? Yes, this has happened before. Secondly the fact that anyone is of any religion is not germane, simply they have an established belief structure.
My sentiments exactly, if any other parents/citizens want to address the underlying controversy, please feel free to send an email directly to hcpscconcernedparents@hotmail.com.
For those individuals who have continually focused on the content issue, I would urge you to examine further the events which have taken place within our public school system. Many posters have commented that the debate must be about content/subject matter, otherwise there could not be a problem.
It is my contention that these subjects, although unpleasant, should be considered at some level in public school. However, when instruction/intervention is carried out in such a manner as to evoke a strong emotional response along with a motivational purpose to compel individuals to seek counseling, those who are conducting the therapeutic intervention must be qualified and cognizant of both positive and negative outcomes. At the same time, provisions must be in place to service as many individuals as possible in accordance to HIPAA regulations. Other considerations for a program such as this should include afterschool care and counseling.
HHS, HCPS administration and BOE have been aware that this program has not been fully vetted by the officials in the school system, neither has the curriculum been reviewed by the general curriculum oversight committee. In addition, the school system has procedures in place for hiring and approving certified, licensed therapists and counselors who are skilled in a variety of therapeutic interventions. Currently, there are no guidelines for a drama therapist, nor is there a drama therapist on staff within the HCPS system. It has been interesting to provide explanation and definition of drama therapy to individuals who have already given the go ahead to this drama therapy program.
Please consider though, this program was heralded as someone’s “BRAINCHILD”. A brainchild which HCPS stood behind cheering, giddily watching as the ink flowed onto the newsprint, mesmerized by having the HCPS name in the state’s largest newspaper.
By refusing to publicly acknowledge the seriousness of what has just happened, these professional educators are leaving a loophole for the next “brainchild” to be birthed—to go forward without passing through the proper filters, curriculum approvals and credential assessments. This time, it was questionable therapeutic intervention into our students’ emotional and mental health; if we allow them to skip off into the sunset with this magical 4 point plan, there is no telling what the future may hold.
Do not allow them to divert and redirect your attention with this 4 point plan. Walk through any public school; you will find evidence of the unread and unenforced policies and procedures in the student handbook: unacceptable language, dress code violations, disrespectful attitudes, unruly classrooms, etc. Teachers have been told not to write so many referrals because it reflects poorly upon the assistant principals and the schools. We have teachers who send students to the office (called the candy store by some students and educators) only to have students sent back to class with notes questioning the teacher’s authority or credibility. The crisis in our schools begins with those in power at the top of the educational pyramid.
For far too long, teachers and parents have been set against each other as enemies. However, it has become crystal clear to me that the problem is not parents and teachers. The problem is with those in the administration. Those who have either never been in the classroom, as is the case with some HCPS principals, or who have been removed from the classroom for too long to remember what it was like to have arbitrary and capricious guidelines impeding the business of teaching. These administrators look upon parents with contempt, regarding us as pesky flies to be flicked from in front of them. These administrators, who ignored safegurads, must be held accountable for such cavalier treatment of and reckless disregard for those most precious to us–our children.
Check out the instructional guide and policy manual for HCPS online; look up the MDSE voluntary curriculum guide as well as state policies; the violations of basic policies of public civility are all addressed in those handbooks. There is even a policy that gives specific instruction on handling controversial issues in the public school setting. In addition, the very presentation of this program as a therapeutic intervention catapults it into the realm of medical treatment.
Medical treatment cannot be prescribed, developed or delivered to students in the public school setting without signed fully informed parental consent paperwork. This paperwork must outline the potential for both positive and negative outcomes related to that specific therapy. There is a provision for students of certain ages to provide signed fully informed consent without notification of the parents, but those cases are limited. Regardless, neither parents nor students were given any understanding of the scope and purpose of this therapeutic intervention.
It has not been my purpose to tell other families what they can and cannot or should and should not do regarding activity in their homes– or even on stage as an optional attendance program. That is not for me to decide. What is my concern, though, is making sure the people whom we have trusted with caring for our children are worthy of our trust.
The intent has been to force the school system to own up to the egregious errors which enabled a high school teacher to employ dramatic, novice interpretations of therapeutic techniques and methods for which he was not licensed, nor certified. Techniques and methods which when practiced incorrectly or without the proper safeguards can deepen the wounds of those suffering, leaving them worse off than before, knowing full well that if they speak out against the HHS drama therapy high school program, they risk ridicule, hate speech and alienation from their peers.
Don’t believe that last bit?…Just ask my girls.
A few points it is not the “Voluntary State Curriculum” The name was always a misnomer as it never was Voluntary but is now called the Maryland State Curriculum.
So I reiterate my Question of January 4th
On what day did you learn of the production, and on what day did you voice your concern?
Based on Rachel Tates own speech at the HCPS BOE meeting her children came home on Friday Dec 4th and tried to tell her about DramaTherapy “but it wasn’t clicking so she went off to do something else” and a parent called her later to ask if her daughters were OK. Real parental concern there huh? Now she speaks behind smoke screens contradicting herself frequently. She said at the BOE meeting that she had no problem with what Mr. Cummins did…yet in this reply above she calls him out. She says she has no problem with the content in one breath but in the next she condemns the content. And once again, her daughters are inciting the repercussions they are receiving. Go on to Facebook and see for yourself. My child has shown me some of the comments that the Tate children have stated. Don’t take my word…look for yourself…then again maybe Rachel Tate should do likewise. Why would the Tate children even feel the need to Join SaveDramatherapy on Facebook except to incite “drama”?
I think it’s ridiculous to focus on Rachel’s comment that she took time to think about what they told her. When I was a teenager I doled out info and now my kids do it…kids dole out info in small bits ESPECIALLY if they think there might be a problem. As a parent, I have “walked away” both to give myself time to process what I heard, and to figure out how to help my child handle a problem without inceasing his stress. If you always immediately know what your kids are trying to say, AND immediately know the best way to respond, great for you, but please give the human parents a bit of a break.
And I would like to know which comments on the Tate girls pages you have a problem with, because having followed the paper comments and the info on facebook, the Tate girls are not the the ones who should be embarrassed.
Well, Violation of law, guess what? There are those that do not want religion thrust down their children’s throats and yet they are subjected to Christian Christmas during the holidays, the words “under God” in the Pledge, prayers at flagpoles, Bibles on teachers desks, etc etc etc etc and on and on. So, these people are also protected YET they STILL have to endure the religious right shoveling their religion. They are just as protected as you think your group of people are. But yet, do you stand to protect them within the confines of the law? Probably not. Because, afterall, your God is better than anyone elses, right?
I understand where you are coming from, however the Christian religion is not forced upon those who choose not to participate in such activities as See You At The Pole or saying the Pledge of Allegiance. No student can be coerced into saying the Pledge, in fact there are many students in my homeroom who choose not to. Whether or not this is a matter of religion or not, students have the right to opt out without punishment. Also, See You At The Pole takes place BEFORE the school day commences, therefore not conflicting with academic classes. Again, this is an OPT IN event, not forcing any students or teachers to participate in praying for the well being of the school and community.
Freedom of religion is granted in the Constitution. As long as there has been no condemnation of other beliefs, religious groups and activities are, in fact, permitted in public schools. Therapeutic intervention, however, is not.
Again – the situation is settled. Some people made a mistake. Does anyone really believe that at 7:45am on December 4 that the school, the BoE and the Central Office deliberately setout to take away parents rights? I don’t think so. And as an attorney you know you would have to prove that that was the intention. Why don’t we stop stirring the pot? Because people can’t help themselves is probably why. Please don’t throw Christianity into the argument though unless there is true Christian intent. I haven’t seen very Christian behavior in most of the behaviors that I’ve observed thus far.
If you have been violated then sue the damn school system. Since you have nothing better to do then continue to act like a moron take action and call it a day…Keep in mind that HCPS is taking a hit and making teachers take a 2% pay cut for next year because of budget cuts why not sue them and take more money out of HCPS budget so all kids can suffer and have less money to actually TEACH our children..If you do not plan on taking action then get over it… I think HCPS heard you and they are taking action so this does not happen again or perhaps you call the school and remove your child from all of the preformances that occur in the school…It does not take a rocket scientist to figure this out…
I think they should take the money from dramatherapy and use it for something more useful, like teachers pay. As for the proposed pay cuts, yes it is totally irrelevant, but as long as you brought it up, I will respond. Trying to garner sympathy for teachers faced with pay cuts will be a very hard sell, especially to those of us who have taken hefty pay cuts and/or been unemployed due to this economy. I have zero sympathy for them, I say welcome to the pay cut club, it’s about time you got here.
Ummm… Pam, how much do you think comes in for DT? People buy ads for the program, otherwise there really isn’t a lot for the production…
The question is not how mych revenue is generated, but how much is spent by the school system to put on the production. Everything from lights and heat for all rehersals, to janitorial service to the time needed to put the sign up, and print the programs. All this costs money, and when faced with tough economic times such as this, every penny needs to be scrutinized. If this program is truly helpful, then by all means continue it, but let it be non mandatory, and offer the follow up necessary.
Yes, 99% of high schoolers deal with sex, drinking and drugs. Those are relevant to all. The other subjects are relevant to fewer students. A better way to approach it may have been to do a play on how a student helped a friend through rape, or abuse. Give the kids ways to help instead of just saying go get help.
I want my kids to learn reading, writing ,math and science in school. I can deal with the rest at home. Sometimes I just think we ask way too much of our teachers and schools. Time to get back to basics.
No, I am not niave enough to think that every parent out there is responsible, thoughtful and caring, but I like to think that there is far more good in the world than bad.
Hey Pam – not that much is spent. I run a full scale drama program myself and the most we pay is in costuming, sets, scripts and royalties – which runs between 3400 and 6000 for all. They use a blackbox theatre effect, modern clothing, scripts written by the kids and pay no royalties. Cost for the Custodians, lighting and such? Probably not even enough to buy a months worth of groceries (at least, not my house of mini-piglets).
And I absolutely agree about the mandatory part. BUT, I think the student should have the choice, not the parent. The reason being is that you really do not know what is going on behind closed doors and who the perpetrators are. A father that is abusing his daughter or a mom that’s a meth head is NOT going to give permission for a kid to see or participate in a program like this. I understand your point about DT type of skits, however, keep in mind that presenting how someone helped someone else is regular theatre and does not give the catalyst to seek help.
I think the idea of having a 5 minute “60-minute” style commentary between each, where the DT director and an ACTUAL therapist or counselor discuss the skit and how to seek help would be an awesome addition and might quill some concerns. Or not. You never know in Havre de Grace. It might take care of one persons concern then you’ll have a parents yelling that they don’t want their kid having therapy…… that is why so many of us are rolling our eyes.
Mrs. Tate,
When will you stop this crap??? When will you turn the other cheek???
Lisa –
With all due respect the finances of HCPS and the potential 2% pay cut have nothing to do with the Drama Therapy debacle.
Rachel Tate has every right to post her opinions, however I agree with you that she should shut up at this point, seek the advise of an experienced attorney to determine if there is a case and explore her options.
I personally don’t think that HCPS/BOE will do anything meaningful about the Drama Therapy matter until they are forced to by legal action.
Joe
Rachel has already turned the other cheek by not responding in kind to all the hateful posts that have been directed at her personally and at her family for standing up and saying that she expects the school board and all of it’s administrators and teachers to follow the law regarding parental rights and notification. Whether you share her values or not she has the same rights to have a voice in this matter as the parents whose children worked in the production.
It was not my intentions on sparking a debate over religions in schools. Maybe I worded my early stated comment incorrectly.
My point was simply that if the school has one assembly deemed optional then, then ALL mandatory assemblies should be optional, simply because they are not part of the curriculum in the class room.I agree with Mr.Tom Barnes, it’s done and over with.
Yes Shannon she has every right to voice her concerns REGARDING her children not other peoples children. Not one person is stating that she does not have that right however where was she when Godspell was being preformed at the middle school last year? This would be a violation of the law. Where was Ms Tate when this violation happened? Where were you?
Ponder this for a moment…..
3 million children in this country are abused every year………………………………………..
And you want to continue the discussion about DT and how it has violated you……
That’s really sad…
The topic at hand is the failure of the administration at Havre de Grace High to properly vet Drama Therapy and inform parents and ask for consent. You attack any one who thinks the school should follow the law and respect parental rights, and you attempt to diminish/divert attention from this conversation with personal attacks and making making illogical arguments such as if you didn’t object to every other violation you don’t have a right to object now….By citing past incidents you demonstrate that someone needs to stand up and say enough. If you think that the school acted properly defend them stop attacking individuals who voice an opinion in the matter.
If 3 million kids are abused every year in this country I would hope that THEY get help by people qualified to deliver it, not by unqualified individuals and high school who failed to consider all of the possible outcomes of treatment the they prescribed to a random group.
How many of them were truly helped by dramatherapy?
How many of them were truly damaged? We haven’t heard about anyone truly damaged at all. Yet, we know of people that were helped.
Tom Barnes –
Once again, it is unfortunate that you cannot bring yourself to even consider the possibility that HCPS overreached with Drama Therapy, generally usurped parental rights and may have harmed students.
You dismiss parent’s rights to disagree with Drama Therapy, demand accountability and seek redress for harm that may have been caused in a court of law.
Joe
The problem Joe is that since HCPS has an action plan at this point to rectify mistakes any law suit at this point would have to be for actual damage caused by this and would have to be demonstrated to have occured, furthermore you would also have to demonstrate that the specific parent would have signed the opt out form if presented. This is alot of “ifs” that would need to occur.
Cdev –
Unless you are an attorney or have extensive experience with lawsuits I think you should stand down. Legal matters turn on facts and we don’t know them insofar as any potential action.
My opinion is that anyone considering legal action in response to HCPS’s insipid and arrogant management of Drama Therapy should get experienced and competent legal advice not available in this forum.
Joe
Joe I am no more an attorney then you are a constitutional scholar yet you interpret it at nauseum! I did take a few school law courses again not qualifying me as an attorney but a law suit does require an actionable position which in this case requires damages as the situation is being remedied.
Cdev –
It’s ad nauseam and not “at nauseum”.
And once again whether there’s a basis for a lawsuit will turn on the facts. You are not in a position to know the facts are you?
Ave atque vale,
Joe
CDev…
You know full well that any and all attempts to disagree with Mr. Joseph Caruso will be dismissed with an insipid and arrogant response.
He is obviously the most educated man in Harford county — because he uses big words…in a lame attempt to demonstrate his own intelligence. Your attempts at having a legitimate debate with him will not succeed because he is always correct…about everything. Just ask him, he’ll tell you….in fact, he will talk down to you and everyone else on the forum who have the slightest disagreement with anything that he might have to say.
You Cdev, are a guttersnipe and an insolent one for even questioning the almighty power and authority that is one Joseph Caruso.
Have a wonderful day.
I forgot that “He is the great and powerful OZ.” I can always hope that he will change.
Shannon – the purpose behind DT is not to GIVE them therapy but to catapult them into SEEKING therapy. And those kids that are getting abused that you HOPE get help? A bunch end up living in homes like mine because of what they are going through. All the HOPE in the world doesn’t take away REAL scars and REAL pain (I have yet to see where any DT performance has caused any scars or pain – just pissed people off on both sides of the argument… oh well, they’ll live).
I am no longer truly involved in this debate because, frankly, it has gotten ridiculous, out of control and people have lost their credibility in many many many ways. I have received quite a few phone calls and emails about how we shut this entire thing down. I’m hardly a leader of “the opposition” but I have given them my opinion: You don’t shut it down – you let people continue to destroy their own reputations (this goes for both sides of the issue). They know what they are doing and they get what they deserve in the long run.
That said, I will finish with what I have said over and over: I would rather some parents be pissed off because their kid saw a program then have kids continue to live with a life of abuse – whether self inflicted, family inflicted or stranger inflicted.
Yes, I hope that any victimized child get help by QUALIFIED therapists. It is admirable that you are a foster parent, since I have not abused any of the 3 million kids, I don’t know what else to say other than if your children benefited from the program during school hours, they would receive the same benefit from a non-mandatory evening performance. You might also consider that not all of the kids who need to seek help would be motivated to do so based on a play at school. That is part of the problem…some of the kids who might have been sensitive to the topics presented may not have enjoyed it, might even have been further traumatized by it..if that is the case do you really expect them to identify themselves to be victimized by the I LOVE DRAMA THERAPY as it is group?
DRAMA THERAPY REGISTRATION
Standards of Registration
The Basis for Registration
The purpose of these Standards of Registration is to identify as Registered Drama Therapists those people who have: expertise in dramatic, theatrical, and performance media; understanding of psychotherapeutic processes with different populations in a variety of settings; experience with the integration of the artistic and psychological aspects of drama therapy; professional work experience in the field of drama therapy, mental health and special education.
If someone at the high school is qualified to administer drama therapy part of the schools problem goes away, they still didn’t notify parents which is against the law.
Actually, Shannon, the kids that I am talking to are being traumatized by the reaction involving the parents, not the program 😉 As for the standards of the national drama therapy – DT at HdG never was part of the national program. That is what seems to be falling on deaf ears. Yes, wonderful – there are standards. Terrific! Implement them as outlined in Volraths plan. PERFECT! Ok, so we have the cure, right? What else is there REALLY to say? Someone made a comment a while back that HCPS won’t bother to do anything unless there is legal action taken. Well, gee, seems to me they put a plan in place. What else is needed? Blood? Then it is just a vendetta, frankly. And that in and of itself is counterproductive to the situation and VERY childish. I call it as I see it and it is what it is. I can tell you this, I may not be involved in this argument any further- because really there isn’t one anymore, it’s merely people complaining at this point – but with two kids starting at the HS you better believe I will get on the committee or be a REALLY big thorn in their side. My background IS in drama and I have training with many issues touched in DT because of the parenting/training classes for Foster and Adoptive care. I will be there to counteract the people that merely want their lifetsyle and religious preferences inserted into the program (on EITHER side of the issue). You betcha!
Tom Barnes –
You just don’t get it do you. Drama Therapy is an experimental rogue program that is out of control.
Drama Therapy was created without appropriate HCPS/BOE oversight, it violated school policies, parental rights were ignored and students may have been harmed. And the reaction by HCPS/BOE has been by accounts uncooperative, dismissive, arrogant and reckless.
The option of legal action is appropriate for recourse and remedy.
Joe
As we are moving forward to secure effective counsel, Harford County Public School Concerned Parents are seeking input from all citizens of Harford County. This is not a HHS issue; the issues raised and actions demonstrated by HCPS officials are cause for concern for everyone in Harford County. A program of such nature when offered in a public school must be carried out with purposed thought on the part of those in charge. At bare minimum, these issues should have been addressed: 1) parents should know ahead of time what was being introduced, 2)some students might not wish to participate in a therapeutic intervention and 3) reviewing, debriefing and response planning, standard components of therapeutic intervention, must be incorporated in order to achieve successful outcomes for all participants.
Those in authority in our school system cannot be allowed to arbitrarily decide which policies and laws which will be enforced with regard to student programming, instruction and parental rights. The citizenry has empowered those within the educational system to educate and care for students. The citizenry must demand accountability of its educators in order to protect society as a whole from current day whims. Fantastical propositions which encourage rules and policies to be shelved and a blind eye turned in the face of a enticing, captivating, cutting-edge, hard-hitting programming which cannot pass muster.
We must hold everyone accountable for their negligent behavior. HCPS concerned parents have not pushed for the dissolution of the HHS drama therapy program; we have insisted that HCPS administrators, Board of Education members and HHS administrators make public acknowledgement of their collective failure to properly vet this program; admit their failure to follow basic policies regarding curriculum review, and make known to the entire parent body of HHS students what took place on December 3 and 4– encouraging them to attend video screenings and debriefing sessions to understand how this program may have affected students in either a positive or negative manner.
We are in full agreement that this was a powerful program. Those individuals who have seen it readily agree that the drama students worked incredibly hard, pouring their hearts into this assembly in an attempt to prompt classmates to seek help with their problems. There has been no dispute of those truths.
Our greatest concern is that HCPS’/HHS’ continued posture of ignoring that a powerful program can have both positive and negative effects results in valuable time being lost to reach those students who may be vacillating, unable to reach out due to the oppressive, forbidding tone of current discourse which causes them to remain quiet.
Newton’s third law of motion states: For every action there is an equal and opposite reaction. Consider then, adults and students stood before the BOE giving testimony to the life-saving and life-changing impact that this program has had in their lives. Does it not stand to reason then that an equal and opposite reaction would leave our community and families with students who are “ticking time bombs” desperately needing our help?
Why, then, would county and school officials choose to ignore continued parental requests to screen this video? It stands to reason that admitting negligence and complicity would render HCPS/HHS liable for legal action, thus, causing legal counsel to encourage stonewalling and sleight of hand maneuvering in hopes that this story completes the standard 60 day news cycle with as little damage as possible. HCPS legal counsel understands the exorbitant cost of litigation; they are rolling of the dice to identify the serious players. It is a sad day when citizens are held captive by institutions with deeper pockets.
These officials have been charged with educating and protecting the students of whom they have accepted care for 7 hours a day, 180 days a year. They seem to have decided that personal preservation and institutional advancement outweigh the need to provide proper therapeutic intervention for those students, families and communities who may have suffered damages due to irresponsible actions of the involved parties.
Rachel,I mean no harm;but your postings are exhausting.This subject has gone way too far. Someone has to just stop this subject now. You keep it going with these long postings;I couldn’t even read it all.(Short and to the point if nothing else).I think you may have started this with some good intentions,even though I totally disagree with you. However, you have stirred up a lot of emotions;not just among parents-but it has caused students that were friends’ to argue.I wish you well;but please stop this.Let it go;you made your point.Plus, you make it sound like every parent agrees with you;there are some of us that do not want or desire to see everything that is being taught to our kids. Some of us choose to trust the school system and the teachers. I know you like to be 100% involved in everything your kids do;but don’t you think at some point you could cut the apron strings? Its high school! You just continue to hold on to this subject;please for the community,administration,student body and our sanity….move on!
Mrs. Tate isn’t “keeping this thing going” with her long postings, she is attempting to inform people as to her real intentions in a logical manner. She usually seems to have to do this when people start slamming “ulterior motive” accusations in here. She is not keeping this conversation going…the people who want to shut her up are. You want to stop writing here? Stop reading here and continuing to stir the pot. Your complaints are centered on the length of the posting/s and your interpretation of her motives. She states her opinion clearly and attempts to enlighten others as to the matter at hand and completely ignores your (and others’) attempts to shut her up because she feels strongly about what she is working for. If you can’t contribute real content, why do you continue to bash her? It’s not fair and it doesn’t set a good example for the students who are watching this all go down. She is entitled to her opinion, her information is well stated, and she isn’t going to just let this die. She will continue to fight for her children’s best interests and, as Shannon has said, “for the children whose parents won’t fight for them.”
Jane Tate
Thanks so much for your post;but maybe you could let Rachel speak for herself?There is no logic;just continued nonsense Jane.We don’t want her to shut up;I am sure there will be another issue at the school in a week or so she can complain about.She just needs to move on from this subject. There are tons of other issues she could concentrate on:drunk driving,posting of alcohol drinking on facebook by teens, World Peace,Haiti…have at it!Thanks Jane for being Rachel’s mouth piece.Are you in the band????
If you’re getting legal counsel and are planning to file a law suit, then you probably should stop posting on here as this is a public forum and can (and probably will) be brought up in court.
Racheal,
Again I ask you 17 days later, When did you learn of the program and how did you contact the school when you learned of it?
It has been 17 days since I first asked you. The school got back to you faster and you complain about how fast they replied to you!
IRONIC!
There was also an article about the production in the Sun:
http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/harford/bal-md.ha.drama05dec05,0,4954501.story
Go CDEV!!!! Notice the date of the article?It was also in HCPS.org too.This below….from 2008!Where was she last year????You might be waiting a while.
© Harford County Public Schools
Home > 2008-09 News and Events > December 2008 > Drama is “therapy” for teen issues in HdG
For the past three years, Havre de Grace High School has presented a series of short plays focusing on teen issue through a group called “Drama Therapy.” The “100 Minutes that Matter” skits are performed for an audience of students, parents and faculty, and focus on a variety of issues that students might experience such as drinking and driving and dating. This year, the program took place in the evening on Thursday, December 4th and also during a school-wide assembly during the day on Friday, December
I contacted the school on Monday, December 7, the first day of school following the program.
The bottom line: The school system has violated its own educational policies regarding curriculum oversight and review; controversial issues and parental information and oversight; by providing a captive audience for experiemental therapeutic intervention; employed an unlicensed, uncertified therapist; did not secure permission of parents for medical intervention; did not/have not offer(ed) ANY counseling/debriefing to aid in processing what was viewed; did not secure signed fully informed consent paperwork from either the parents or the students; ignored program development process of scope and learning, etc.
HCPS is attempting to hold up this four point plan to redirect and divert attention from fact that they have trampled parental rights, violated their own policies, discarded medical ethics and codes of conduct; trampled state and federal laws and are continuing to ignore parents’ requests to screen the video.
BTW, I checked my December download from the MDSE website: the name may have changed somewhere, but the not what I pulled off of the state site. It remains titled VOLUNTARY State Curriculum. As I understand you are part of the system, I just thought you’d want to know. Perhaps, your buds will respond to you and have that changed.
Have a great day.
Rachel – please explain to us how they are holding up the plan at this point. I want to be on board with you about the situation of the school systems failure (you and I already know we don’t agree about the content – but whatever on that). Please inform. Thanks (and you have a good day as well) ~ Tom
Again Tom, whether or not Mr. Cummins ever intended to pursue training that would qualify him provide or oversee the production of this type of material to school students during school hours is not the issue. The issue is that he did so without the proper approval, apparently making it more risque each year. He broke the law. Any administrator who blew off a parent voicing concern whether it was one or one hundred concerned parents broke the law. That is not a religious issue, that is a legal issue.
If you are qualified to administer this type of program, the by all means I think the drama club would appreciate your help…I’m sure your experiences with foster/adoption has given you unique perspective about kids in special circumstances…unfortunately, not all victims respond to the same therapy the same way, not all children at the school are victims, and it is the schools job to make sure all of them are considered equally not just your family.
I have not seen Rachel or any parent who has voiced concern over the DT insert religion into this conversation…so far the only people to bring it into this conversation have been kids making jokes and parents trying to diminish the opposition and cloud the issue.
Actually, Shannon, if you read what the “lawyer” wrote, he/she did bring religion into it – specifically Christian parents.
I quote:
“The potential scenarios faced by Christian parents typically fall into two basic categories; those that involve some degree of student coercion and those that involve mere “exposure” to objectionable or offensive ideas. There is a strong constitutional argument under the Fourteenth Amendment, that parents, and only parents, have the right to direct their children’s moral, ethical, and religious development. The claim of Christian parents that school curricula has infringed their right under the due Process Clause of the Fourteenth Amendment to control the education of their children is derived from a line of significant Supreme Court cases….”
I myself am a Gnostic Christian. Frankly, I don’t find my rights infringed on at all. 🙂
I had to go reread the lawyers comment, my interpretation was a lawyer citing examples in case law,(stating that even if the only problem with this production was a Christian parent objecting to the values presented in non-academic subject matter, the parent would still have the legal right to object) not a parent citing their religion as the complaint against DT. Could be wrong, but since his point was that said parent would be within their legal rights, and that the school is prohibited usurping the parents right to teach morals and values.
Personally, I think a standard of behavior is appropriate in a public high school regardless of your spiritual background. I know agnostics, atheists and Christians and in each group there are decent, good hearted people, who don’t use cuss words, watch sexually explicit tv/movies most of them are unassuming, and tend to avoid confrontation. To assume that the only reason a parent might object to the material presented in DT is because of their faith is kind of close minded.
I do not deny that lots of teenagers cuss, have sex, smoke and drink. The schools response, “well they do it anyway so why object” is not the proper stance for a teacher or school administrator…I would like the standard the school pushes to be a little higher than the studio execs at MTV.
You are so right, Shannon. Why must we continue to measure ourselves or lower our standards to meet those of the “lowest common denominator” instead of aspiring to meet the standards and challenges set by people who have successfully managed to run the gauntlet of adolescence and the teen years and become adults who exemplify the character required to do so? Seems most everybody who is in opposition here fails to recognize a cogent discussion with pertinent and relevant points. Rather those points are ridiculed and diversions (such as making it about religion) are initiated into the conversation. Sad, really sad.
Yeah, Joe Caruso, I get “it.” And I am bored to tears with “it” as soooooooooo many parents, students and citizens of Havre de Grace are. I cannot be convinced otherwise that it is not personal when there was a resolution to the issue…. yet people are still throwing around that “sue” word. If you are TRULY out for a change, you WORK on a resolution, ensure the resolution is upheld, etc – you don’t threaten people with lawsuits, slander their name, etc. You just don’t. Period.
The last person who I heard about that was perfect had nail wounds in His wrists and a crown of thorns on His head. So, I will just finish with this: In the words of Dolly Parton – “Get off the cross, honey, someone else needs the wood.”
What seems to be the main sticking point here is that there already Are policies in effect which were blatantly ignored by the administration within the high school! There is no resolution yet. I repeat, no resolution only a proposal. The people who keep bashing Mrs. Tate are just playing into the school board’s overall plan of letting this thing burn itself out so they don’t have to take any action at all. Has anyone who requested a second showing of the video received a response to their request yet? I am really rooting for the poor folks who continue to make the effort to explain these things to the ones who refuse to understand that the bottom line here is the fact that the BoE failed to do its job by not enforcing by policies already in place! I haven’t seen any “new” policy adopted by the board to address this matter, I have only heard about a “proposed plan.” How can you trust the BoE to enforce any new policy put into effect if they can’t or won’t enforce the ones already in place?
Good point!
Jane – I don’t think anyone is playing into anything. It has pretty much been agreed upon that Rachel is ABSOLUTELY 110% correct about many things: Lack of admin response, lack of admin info release and lack of care in how it handled the Friday afternoon show (and frankly, that ticked me a bit as well… you don’t just dismiss the students after having them view something like DT – it should have been done earlier in the week). However, where the agreement ends is whether we become dismissive of the current efforts by Volrath. Trust me, I am NOT fan of that man after my own family’s issues of being disregarded last year, so backing him up in any way is a hard pill to swallow on my end. We also disagree on whether the material was appropriate or relevant (many of those situations are VERY relevant, some only minutely).
This is getting redundant on my end but fingers have been slapped and eyes have been opened. I guess my whole point/question is whether it is necessary to continue tearing a person down (Mark) who has apologized and understands the parents concerns or attacking the school system when they are motivated to take steps to change the program? As a Christian man, a sincere apology to me is worth gold. Those are people you work WITH not against. I haven’t seen or heard that the school system has apologized for it’s inactions, yet Mark. View the BoE taping….
Let me be blunt here. Last year the MS did “Godspell.” Children from the 5th grade at many elementary schools in the area were shipped in to the MS to see a religious musical on a religious subject with a female playing the lead of Jesus. None of the parents were warned about any of that in a permission slip. The material was not presented for parents review prior to the trip. MANY parents were offended to find a female played the lead role. Many others who are not familiar with the musical were offended that it was even presented on school property during the school day. Should they then now go back and slap the wrist of the hard working EXTREMELY dedicated teacher who put the musical together? Should they go after the principal? Should they go after both the elementary AND the secondary school directors? Should they go after the principals of all the schools who didn’t put all the information on the permission slip or didn’t allow for the approval of the script?? Instead that group of parents said it was an “OOOOPPPPSSSS” and let it slide because people worked very hard to put on the production and no INTENTIONAL harm was done.
Understand the word INTENTIONAL. Mark Cummins meant NO intentional harm. None. If he had, I would be totally pissed about that and demand his job. But, plain and simply, he didn’t. I do not believe that HHS meant any harm either. Did they screw up by not sending out permission slips/flyers? YOU BETCHA! Did they do it intentionally? I hardly think so. Did they “stonewall” about releasing the info? Could be. It was over the holidays, colleges are closed and I realize how hard it is to get a hold of the people that handle the tapes – they have lives, too, and at the holidays they are as busy as the rest of us. Our issues just may not be as important to them as they are to us. Let’s not be self-centered. And the scripts were student work and are protected as well. This I entirely understand and some patience and a little understanding could have been used without being wrathful. The particular skit that caused this uproar in the first place? Well, it was written by the daughter of a minister. She is VERY friendly, EXTREMELY active in Harford County and COMPLETELY approachable. Was that minister approached to see if she would mind handing over the script that her daughter wrote? Somehow I really really REALLY doubt it. See, there was at least one other route to take before getting so flustered. If there were one, then there were other routes. How about getting the script from one of the actors, especially in a small town like Havre de Grace? Someone had to know someone who knew someone….
Getting back to “Godspell” – some one can argue “Well EVERYONE knows what ‘Godspell’ is about!” NOT SO FAST. Many do not at all! Yet, the response could be, “Well, EVERYONE knows what Drama Therapy is about – it has been produced for 3 years in a row!” And some that are complaining about it right now? Gee, some of them have children that have seen it in the past or participated in it in the past. And certainly if the parents were involved and discussed school with the kids they already would have known right off what was going on, what it was about and could have easily sent a note in saying Little Johnny does not have my permission to attend. By point is that some people are on fire with a lynch mob mentality when, actually, they should be looking at themselves in the mirror and saying, “Yeah, I screwed up as a parent. I knew what it was about or I didn’t listen and I shouldn’t have the school shouldering the responsibility for my own ignorance on this matter.”
I will repeat this: I stand behind Rachel 100% on the school issues. If she formed a task force that confronted the need for changes to how the school contacts and interacts with the parents and on how admin dismisses the parents, I am right there with her – SIGN ME UP! I’ve personally had wayyyyy too many issues with the MS the past 3 years and many with the HS (prior to Ms. Wallings – I haven’t had the pleasure of dealing with the school in the past 2 years or so). BUT – if this is just about wanting blood and burning books – FORGET IT. I will not and cannot stand by and let a small group of disgruntled parents try to dictate to my family or me what MY kids can and cannot see or participate in while in school. We also have rights and they do not revolve around the towns supposed ‘elite.’
Godspell was an optional afterschool event. The performance was not during school hours. It was held on Friday and Saturday evenings. In the event you attended and did not care for the program, you were free to leave anytime.
As for the special performance for the fifth graders, those students had signed parental permission slips to go to the middle school for the purpose of watching Godspell.
Excuse me, I meant to post that in response to someone else. I see that you answered in a similiar fashion. Sorry to be redundant.
Permission slips yes – but they were not told what the curriculem was nor offered an opportunity to review the script. The argument is still the same.
DT was also offered, just like Godspell, as an afterschool event. Seems to me we are comparing apples to apples here, with the exception of the permission slip – which you already know I support you on 😉
Clarifying my “supposed elite” comment – this was not directed at a single person or group but to those on ANY side of ANY argument who think they know what is best for my family/child just because they have status or money.
Dearest Tom Barnes –
Legal action is an appropriate option to consider in seeking resolution to a matter. In this situation it seems HCPS is being uncooperative and arrogant and a lawsuit may be the only way to achieve resolution.
Regarding slander, I don’t know to what you are referring? And your invocation of Christ with the “wisdom” of Dolly Parton is not compelling.
Joe
Let me be blunt Joe Caruso – I really could not give a rat’s butt what you do or do not “find compelling” any more then you probably care that I find you to be arrogant and simple. But I am sure that your postings are meant to spark some form of outrage or retaliation. That is what people of your caliber shot for hoping that you can get weak individuals to buy into it. I’ve dealt with that kind of personality flaw in people for well over 40 years now – it’s school yard bully tactics. Epic fail, Joe Caruso. And I couldn’t care any less about who you are, who your friends are, why you might think you have position of power or anything else. Note: I am not impressed one bit.
HCPS has been cooperative, supplied the info in a not so timely fashion, as well as formated and implemented an action plan to handle the situation. Just because someone didn’t get done in their time doesn’t mean it didn’t get done. That, Joe Caruso, will hold up in court. Right now what is going on is the equivilant of a 3 year old throwing a temper tantrum in the middle of Walmart.
And to make sure it gets posted directly under MY name, here you go, Joe Caruso:
Let me be blunt Joe Caruso – I really could not give a rat’s butt what you do or do not “find compelling” any more then you probably care that I find you to be arrogant and simple. But I am sure that your postings are meant to spark some form of outrage or retaliation. That is what people of your caliber shot for hoping that you can get weak individuals to buy into it. I’ve dealt with that kind of personality flaw in people for well over 40 years now – it’s school yard bully tactics. Epic fail, Joe Caruso. And I couldn’t care any less about who you are, who your friends are, why you might think you have position of power or anything else. Note: I am not impressed one bit.
HCPS has been cooperative, supplied the info in a not so timely fashion, as well as formated and implemented an action plan to handle the situation. Just because someone didn’t get done in their time doesn’t mean it didn’t get done. That, Joe Caruso, will hold up in court. Right now what is going on is the equivilant of a 3 year old throwing a temper tantrum in the middle of Walmart.
Dearest Tom Barnes –
There’s no need for you to get your panties in a knot.
And since you couldn’t care less about me…why is it that you seem to care a whole lot? I think you should try harder to ignore me and with real effort on your part you might be successful.
Have a nice day,
Joe
Frankly, the quote from Dolly Parton was just plain tacky.
Anyone that has a real point would use a real name and not hide behind a screen name. Just an observation. Is that tacky to you, too? I’m starting to see Rachel Tate’s ‘groupies’ as big problems for her campaign.
Don’t blog much, Tom Barnes? It is rare for people to use real names on the Internet. Although people obviously say things they might not say to your face–or in public–when they are blogging, it doesn’t mean those things are not “real” (your word not mine). And many things can be said on here by people who really do know what they are talking about. When you read for a while, you figure out who the people are who are informed. They are harder to find on some blogs than others.
Sorry, Tom Barnes, but you can’t call me one of Rachel Tate’s “groupies” ’cause I don’t even know her. I am just saying “as an interested observer” that your quote from Dolly Parton was a poor attempt at ridiculing Joe Caruso and had no point. I’m with “Not from Here”. That response to your accusations says a lot.
Seems to me everyone is very busy getting upset with everyone else. I am left wondering what the students got out of this? Sounds like bad ideas. I am glad my child does not attend HdG High, because I don’t think she would have interpreted what she saw in a positive productive way. These students were given no guidance as to whether or not the characters handled things wisely. I think the subject matter goes to show that these kids obviously have important issues on their minds that need attention. This would have been a great opportunity to get the kids to work through better solutions than those presented in the skits. The question is why didn’t that happen? Parents should not be pressuring each other right now, but pressuring the school to do the follow up group counseling that should have happened after the assembly.
I agree about the guidance issue. And that is one thing that is in Volraths plan from what I understand. Doing the show on a Friday afternoon then the kids having to go to buses… not the smartest planning for the assembly.
HCP: Many of us are not “upset with everyone else.” We are incredulous and bewildered and still trying to figure the exact purpose. I personally am far from defending the school/BoE/central office. They screwed up not once but at least twice. If we can focus the anger in the right direction, awesome – we can accomplish something. But crucifying a teacher doesn’t accomplish that. 😉
I have recently learned that at least one male student with special needs was hysterical after watching the simulated suicide. He had to be removed and taken to the other building to calm down. I am fairly certain that school officials did not send home a note or call to say: “We are sorry to inform you that your student was greatly disturbed during our assembly today. We had him watch a simulated suicide which he interpreted as real. Please let us know how we can assist you as you help him recover from this traumatic experience.” I can also say that I am fairly certain that exposure to such things were not included in his IEP, either.
If any poster on here knows any parents/students affiliated with the HHS special education program, PLEASE tell them to contact hcpsconcernedparents@hotmail.com. Anonymous reports or comments are welcome. We are desperately trying to make parents are aware of what has happened and to get students the help that they need.
Very sad situation indeed! I am sorry the young man had to endure that. I am sure harming him was not the intention but someone should have been smart enough to think that he might not be able to handle it. How about that students helper?
On a side note, I know 3 kids personally who were helped. Do you want that information as well?
So, it’s good to know that amateur therapists only have to achieve a students helped/students harmed ratio of 3:1 to make it worthwhile (ignoring, of course, the degree of help or harm). I’m sure trained therapists are in line with this, and I suppose you would welcome the school participating in your line of work without the education or experience that you possess.
Perhaps they can next move on to performing dental work or laparoscopic surgery. No messy permission slips or parental review needed. Or could you actually think that amateur therapy is always harmless since it’s just words and acting and stuff and junk like that? What could go wrong?
Content of an assembly is seldom written into in IEP as that is not the point of an IEP. An IEP simply is designed to offer a child the a document of their learning disability and to spell out the conditions of the least restrictive learning enviornment that would meet the childs needs. Furthermore the accomadations needed to meet those needs. It also includes a transition plan in high school to phase out those accomadations as IEP’s do not exist in the workplace.
Tom, “a helper” is not something given to all students with an IEP. Usually it is the physically handicapped and a few children with behavioral needs who have IH’s.
Racheal do you have the same concern for the many other special needs children in the auditorium? Singling out a child because he had special needs, esentially what you are doing, is short sighted. It would not matter if the child who was hysterical had special needs or not. The level of compassion should still be the same. Special needs kids don’t need “shielding” they are very resillient. While I respect your right to be informed, a special needs child who can not handle or cope with a rated R movie is clearly in the wrong LRE in a high school setting!
RACHEL
Please stop this…please. We got a letter in the mail Friday,its in the Aegis and the Record…plus this site.When is enough enough? By God,do you work? Get a flippin life. Some us are sick of hearing your name and this subject;its been over a month now.Plus bringing up the other child is wrong….you have no business spreading such rumors.Where did you get your info? Your daughters hearsay?Thats quite enough…..
HDGHSP2 –
Of what are you afraid?
Is Rachel a threat to you?
Why do you dismiss Rachel and other’s reasonable and legitimate concerns regarding various aspects of the Drama Therapy fiasco?
Joe
Mr. Caruso, Respectfully I say:
I am not afraid-annoyed mostly. This is in our face everyday-mail,facebook,newspaper etc. Look, I work in the school system too. Not this much is made over kids bringing drugs to school(btw…that happened at HDG recently). Not much was said about that-why? We have kids fighting,being rude to teachers,have no coats to put on,not doing there homework,parents not coming in for meetings etc etc. Being African American;if I complained about every little thing they displayed about us that I found offensive-please!Plus, I really think the school system does a great job;and I don’t believe in book burning either. Kids need to be aware of situations; and to be honest in this case….parets needed to “butt out”.The kids would have not been as upset;but now they have their parents on a “roll”.I see both sides;but enough of this already.If I had to preview everything my kids saw at the school;I would have no time to work both of my jobs. Where are the parents at the PTA meetings,teacher meetings, selling sodas at the games? Now, they are all bent out of shape over a gun shot? What movie did their kid watch last night? No sir, I am not a hypocrite. Its alright as long as its in my home;no-that is not me.Now Mrs. Tate was upset because it was a mentally challenged child in a skit;I get it-but what about us? Would this have been considered a racial thing if I said something about African Americans? Would you all have been posting all this if it was a black person being shot;and I stood up? I think not.She made her point;now be done!
HDGHSP2, Your comments about race are over-the-top and beyond the pale since there is no racial component to this discussion on Drama Therapy. You should be ashamed of yourself.
John
To HDGHSP2: Per Post 62.1 from Cindy Baker, the letter sent out and received by HHS parents doesn’t say they’re changing anything about the program. In fact, as I read it, it states that if you opt your children out of the performance your children will be taken elsewhere in the school and taught the same issues for a similar educational outcome. Huh? How does that address the issue of parents wishing to address these matters themselves? I question whether or not this is a plan endorsed or agreed to by the BoE, the letter was from Principal Walling, not the Board. There are no Board signatures on the letter. It looks like more business as usual. BTW, the example of the one child presented by Rachel as being very disturbed by the scene in which the gunshot was fired was reported by an adult in attendance at the performance not by Rachel’s daughters. It is a pertinent point and relevant to the subject at hand. Just as suggested by Phil Dirt (55.1.1), a ratio of 3:1 (students helped:students harmed) isn’t a reasonable outcome. That boy was directly affected by the performance. It is not a rumor. The mere fact that instances as appalling as those portrayed on the stage were similar to those experienced by children who have already sought/received sanctuary in Tom Barnes’ home doesn’t count as “helping” children in need of help. They’ve already been helped. What about those who were in the audience adversely affected by the portrayals? Children who may be incapable of even recognizing the damage inflicted (INTENTIONALLY or NOT)upon them. Trust has been broken by a teacher’s and principal’s failure to properly follow policies already in effect which would have prevented this entire matter. The letter does not address properly the matter of fault here. The letter states that nothing, essentially, will change. The matter is not closed. If you’re tired of the matter, stop reading this blog, stop trying to shut down Rachel’s efforts. It’s not “enough” until a mutually agreed upon resolution has been reached. RE-read the letter from Principal Walling until you understand that nothing will change… it is there in black and white. You just have to decipher the “edu-speak”, first.
BLAH…Blah….Blah!
Enough I say!!!!
I could not even read your post…got half way…and was tired from your long “windedness”.Has anyone ever heard of “short and to the point”? Obviously not on the Rachel Tate team(rah rah)….they must be a ball at parties.How is your kid?Its probably an hour conversation in full detail!You must send out those 3 page holiday letters too…..
Move on to something else;I know-World Peace,Haiti,Kids putting something inappropraite on Fb,Drunk driving….move on I say…move on.
Congratulations on joining the many others here who just don’t have the time or attention-span to put the neccessary energy into ensuring that the schools to which I send my children are abiding by their own stated policies and regulations…let someone else do it for you. There, “short-winded” enough for you?
While I do support Mrs. Tate’s efforts, I do have a mind (and ability and interest) to form my own opinions and will take independent action as I deem neccessary. I just appreciate working with someone who is as committed as I am to working toward a common cause. It’s called cooperation.
Mrs. Tate 2,
I am not a hypocrite;who thinks my kids are perfect.When they hear bad words in a book or skit-I don’t go running screaming it’s inappropriate. Why? If you allow your kids to watch any “Rated R” movie,get on the internet,hang out with friends,text,twitter etc…then you can not complain about that skit;its called being a hypocrite.Now you want to use the lame excuse that you aren’t there watching them and approving it-thats crap-still a hypocrite. I don’t believe in book burning, or getting upset about a DVD a teacher chooses to show the class(that may have some offensive materials in it). This is high school not nursery school.I will say this,”METHINKS THE LADDIE DOTH PROTEST TOO MUCH”-I wonder why? Something going on at home…hmmmm?
OOps forgot:
Def: Hypocrite
1 : a person who puts on a false appearance of virtue or religion
2 : a person who acts in contradiction to his or her stated beliefs or feelings
I have to wonder exactly what Ms. Tate hopes to accomplish by this spurious law suit. An already economically challenged school system will now have to divert funds needed elsewhere to defend itself. Ms. Tate’s anecdotal evidence offered here will need to be verified by personal student interviews. Has she considered the effects of that on the students in question?
There is no law suit, Mrs. Tate states that counsel is being considered. No law suit has been filed per any posts here…plenty of advice to sue but no statement that one has been filed. Yikes…this is like watching a game of “rumours” and waiting to see how statements can be misconstrued from one post to another. As for the person who asked if I’m “in the band”? I don’t even have a kid at this school, I’m just reading the posts and shaking my head in confusion as to how Mrs. Tate’s posts can be so wrongly interpreted. Seems to me the best course would be to let the ugliness go and see how it all plays out according to “due process” (please don’t interpret that as a call for a law suit…I’m just talking about what happens when one person writes a letter making a request and the person to whom the letter was written responds with a direct answer) without further sniping at eachother. The question still remains: what is the status of the requests for a second showing by parents who couldn’t make it to the first showing? Are there any parents who made that request posting here? Has there been a 2nd viewing yet? Has one been scheduled? Has anyone received a response to the request to have it shown again? Just curious where the BoE is on that matter…anyone? anyone? Bueller?
minqua –
How can you say that a lawsuit that does not exist be “spurious”?
Is what you are really trying to say is that Mrs. Tate’s concern regarding Drama Therapy is “spurious”?
What does the HCPS budget shortfall have to do with any potential lawsuit being filed?
Have you considered the negative effects of Drama Therapy on students past, present and future?
Joe
hahahahaha! “Have you considered the negative effects of Drama Therapy on students past, present and future?” too funny. you don’t give a damn about any good it has done. no one should even bother to consider the screaming small horde of parents who are pitching a fit. a parent blows off their child having a conversation with them,admittedly, but it is the schools fault that parent didn’t pay them any mind? trying to get a teacher fired, a director fired? ruin or take over a program? power trip much? typical expected repeated behavior.
screaming hoardes? That seems to be the DT fans.
GEG –
Is right I may not give a damn about the immeasurable “good” that has come from Drama Therapy, however I care very much about the damage it has wrought.
Joe
GEG –
Genius absolute genius!
You have made a credible and cogent argument. I am in awe of your brilliant repartee.
Have a very nice day,
Joe
Well Joe it’s better then what you got to say….Loved the Sarcasm GEG..
Dear Jane –
Do you oftentimes confuse ad hominem attacks with sarcasm? I hope for all our sakes you do better with red and green traffic signals.
Joe
Pardon me Lisa I guess I had Jane on my mind, my apologies. The previous message is for you, Lisa.
Thanks for clearing that up, Joe! You almost hurt my feelings! Thanks for my “new word” search, though! Can’t wait to use “ad hominem” in general conversation!
Jane –
You can use ad hominem in response to most of Lisa Barber’s posts.
Joe
Joe: problem is…she’s not even going to get that. Did you include “bloody hilarious” in your list below? (made me lol!) Finally, a little levity after all the howling. So, the principal sends out a letter apologizing for the division this whole matter has caused (not for failing to properly vet the material, herself, and ensure that federal laws were maintained per existing stated HCPS policy by presenting an extra-curricular theatre production in a mandated school-wide assembly) and announces (at the bottom of a double-sided letter typed in 8 point font) that there will be a second screening of the video and it is scheduled in 3 business days from the date of your receipt [letter dated 1/21/10 (Thursday), received 1/22/10(Friday), screening scheduled for 1/27/10(Following Wednesday)]. Screening begins at 7pm, it takes about 2 hours +/- to show. Oh, and President Obama’s “State of the Union” address begins at 9pm…will there be time for follow up discussion following this presentation, either?
I spoke to a parent the other day who had attended the 1st screening. She told me that she “just felt incredibly sad the whole next day”. Another parent felt like there should have been a “real content” discussion about some of the things that she had watched up there because “it just broke her heart” that the students had seen that and not even been warned that it was coming (these scenarios? in school? without warning?) or having any way to neccessarily process or express what was the most disturbing about what they had seen. In school. That day. Just seems weird. No apology for failing to properly follow stated review and approval polices of material that could make the mother of three teenagers “sad the whole next day” after seeing what her children had seen in school. She’s sorry for the uproar that it caused but she doesn’t mention that she’s sorry for failing to do her job in the first place. I’m just saying.
Jane
Second viewing is Jan 27 7pm
President Obama’s “State of the Union” address begins at 9:00pm.
Oooops. Same night. Sorry, forgot to include that.
No Joe I just simply find you to be an A%%.
Lisa –
Funny thing about opinions…everyone has one.
If there was an award for inane carping you’d have a little statue on your mantel.
Joe
Lisa – don’t buy into it. Not worth your energy or effort, trust me. More on that later 😉
And the argument comes to a close. Anyone who recieved the two page letter from HCPS will know that. Effectively the program remains, NO parents or students will be on a “board” to influence their own will/lifestyle/religious preferences on the program and it will continue forward with a few tweeks and bandages (ones that I personally can agree with). No one has lost their job and the program has not been lost. Excellent. For me, two main goals were met in all this controversy.
Now, onto more important work for the county: How about getting a group of concerned parents together, as I have repeatedly said, to address the issue of a lack of care and support of parents from central office?
That isn’t the same letter I received Tom. It was nice to read that the concerns won’t be addressed so we can do the same thing next year.
Why shouldn’t parents be involved? Our will SHOULD be put into what are children are exposed to. I don’t understand why HCPS/HHS are so adamant about letting this program continue as a school assembly. Leave it untouched and make it an evening assembly. Totally thumbing their noses at concerned parents. That should aggrivate every parents on either side of the issue.
They might say that, but I have a feeling that what remains will be vanilla, bland, and useless. A parent uproar has been made and HCPS and the Board of Bobbleheads will declare that are right and run like hell.
If you want to get their attention, start getting the state legislators calling them. When that happens, they fall all over themselves to make a change.
Well Joe I can say I agree with you on everyone has an opinion…My opinion of you is that you are a condensing a$$…Wow I feel better
Lisa –
Oh, so I’m condensed, interesting?
Don’t forget to polish your mantel statue. Hey I have a question; if you get an award for inane carping is it a cast of an actual carp?
Joe
Haha funny Joe….
I find you to be discourteous, disrespectful, impudent, insolent; arrogant, cavalier, high-handed; supercilious; pompous, self-important.
BTW did I leave anything else out??????
Have a great day
Lisa – Not to worry, you pegged ‘it’ for what ‘it’ is. But you left out that it is a “baiter” (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Baiter). ‘Its’ type has been around long before the Internet – the type use to just be known simply as ‘trouble makers’ or ‘trash talkers.’ ‘It’ is that mean nasty kid that started trouble on the playground or poked fun at whoever ‘it’ could in school just to get a rise out of some poor soul and try and make ‘itself’ popular – which just failed. That type of ‘person’ (loosely used term), essentially, is not worthy of the oxygen ‘it’ wastes that good and decent people could be using. I don’t know about you, but I find ‘its’ connection interesting. ‘It’ certainly doesn’t help the ‘protesters’ side much. And after talking to several well-connected and established HdG people and questioning the name that ‘it’ has used to post, I find that ‘it’ probably doesn’t really exist (in other words, the name is not ringing a bell with anyone and surely in this small town someone knows someone who knows someone who knows someone…and so one, right?).
Isn’t it funny how people don’t use their REAL names, as if they are afraid of the very stance they take? Very funny indeed – and extremely discrediting to their ‘cause’ – which I am also finding doesn’t really exist either. So, again, Lisa, don’t waste your breath on a useless argument that will get you nowhere. ‘It’ is merely trying to make itself relevant. Like they say in the south, “Never wrestle with a pig – you never win, you just get dirty and it makes the pig meaner.”
Now, putting the focus back on the topic and off the lesson of personality disorders: There is a plan in place, Drama Therapy – while changing it’s name – will now be even stronger and improved, it is remaining in the hands of Mark Cummins and a good and decent man/teacher didn’t get fired. Kudo’s. It’s nice to have parent involvement to improve a program for our schools, isn’t it?
Tom Barnes –
As I’ve previously posted you seem to care a great deal about what I have to say so much so that you are consumed by it. Evidenced by your your responses to Lisa that are intended to attack and address me.
It is unfortunate that you cannot bring yourself to even consider the possibility that HCPS overreached with Drama Therapy, generally usurped parental rights and may have harmed students. You dismiss parent’s rights to disagree with Drama Therapy, demand accountability and seek redress for harm that may have been caused in a court of law.
Joe
Go Joe!
If my own thoughts are correct he is a man with a life long journey of corporate jobs with titles that are as long as they are overpaid, pretty sure he lives in a cushy little palace up on a hill far above the lower beings that he likes to look down on and get his jollies going. And the best part, for a guy with such high opinions of himself, he probably did not see that he was “getting in on the slice of paradise” right before housing would go belly up. And he probably has such disdain for everyone and everything because it will probably take decades before the value goes back up there. And those “fees” charged to keep paradise looking so good just keep going up. Gosh, no wonder he is so unbearable, maybe all of those “things” the “suave,sophisticated” man has “worked so hard for” haven’t made him happy after all?
Most likely correct, Amused. The debates over – I will let the ‘posse’ have their fun and make their snide comments. I received no pertinent information from any of them that would change my opinion at all. I’m still in agreement with Rachel on a portion and stand with the school on the other. So, their comments were for naught, but I am sure they had a blast!! Gee, they sure got me, didn’t they? I’m so wounded. Anyway, it isn’t worth the breath or the bandwidth – I have too many aawesome projects that I am working on to deal with bullcrap.
Tom Barnes writes – “I have too many aawesome projects that I am working on to deal with bullcrap.”
Yet you do, Tom. In fact, you chase the very thing you deny!
Joe
Lisa –
Yes you left a few things out…erudite, suave, debonair, international man of mystery, intellectual, hipster, sophisticate and possible secret agent.
Joe
Be sure to add, “bloody hilarious!” But seriously, quit “egging her on” and keep on posting the pertinent points you have made quite well in other posts. You have made good points in many of your posts…let’s stick to the subject and ignore Lisa Barber’s reckless regard for the subject at hand. Cindy Baker’s most recent post makes sense. I am curious as to your opinion on “the letter”, did you receive a copy or an email? Only parents of HHS students received the letter. Other interested parties were sent an email if an email address was provided.
Lisa no point in having a battle of wits with an unarmed man!! When people attack others instead of the issue then there is no issue 😉
Uh, Lisa twice called him an ass (once a ‘condensing’ ass – I suppose she meant condescending), and you advise her not to argue with someone who attacks others? I can see who is also unarmed in this battle of wits.
Lisa Barber has posted 11 times here. I didn’t see much contribution to content but mostly stone throwing, diversion, and name calling. Thanks for pointing out the obvious, Phil.
I am glad that my child had an opportunity to see this play. My husband and I saw it first and totally approved of it. We have a daughter who has a disability and is an adult now. I wish there was
this type of therapy for her at the time she was in HS. But in our
day it was taboo to speak of situations of abuse to anyone. We and many of our friends are glad that times are changing. Times now allow for a child to feel comfortable in speaking about matters like this. If they didn’t have this outlet they would grow up to be disturbed adults. Abuse of any form is a bid thing for a child to hold in. We should be more supportive of the sources we do have. We are glad that kids have such resources out there for them. We are assured of our kids have a more well rounded education.