From Harford County government:
County Executive David R. Craig will address the potential negative budgetary impact the shift of teacher pensions to Harford County will have, should the Maryland General Assembly adopt the Governor’s recommendation.
If the legislature enacts the FY 2013 budget with the shift of teacher pensions to local jurisdictions, Harford County will sustain a $9.8 million debt as a result of such action. The $9.8 million debt could effect a variety of services including, education, police, fire, libraries and non-profit organizations that receive funding support from Harford County Government.
Craig will make his statements Monday afternoon at the Harford County Board of Education’s A. A. Roberty Building in Bel Air. Robert M. Tomback, Ph.D., Superintendent of Schools; Leonard D. Wheeler, Ed.D, President, Board of Education; Sheriff L. Jesse Bane, Harford County Sheriff’s Office; Mary Hastler, Director of the Harford County Public Library; and Randy Cerveny, President of the Harford County Education Association are expected to join him.
I am glad that we have the HCEA on our side. Thank god for the leadership. They are working for the members and making sure we squeeze every cent out of every Harford County Taxpayer. Bet Randy tries, again, to make himself look important, but ends up hurting the teachers.
What does this have to with the topic?
MONEY………
The problem is that you got the services, but don’t want to pay the bills. As a fiscal conservative, I find that offensive. If I don’t pay for it, I don’t expect government to give it to me for free. It is not really free because other taxpayers will be picking up the tab. Cutting services is the best solution.
Tell that to a free lunch student? Why do you think we pay taxes to the state to pay for our schools? The problem is that the county is going to have to pay for the services in the school. The OMalley govt wants to raise the sales tax on gas and pass the bills to the county. Im sure the HCEA will come up with some excuse to fight the county exec on this one. They are going to grab for more money and the police, fire and everyone else is going to be left in the dust (SO THEY THINK) Oh and I do pay for services that I get. My parents taught me that you pay for what you get. The fiscal conservatives are the ones who want the tea party and let the child left freezing and without food in school.
Free lunch students get their lunches funded through federal subsides. Funny thing though a 1st through 5th year teacher with a family of four qualifies for free and reduced lunches.
HCEA is fight to improve the school for the children of Harford County. It is hard to say that we are squeezing anyone when we are among the lowest paid teachers in the state. Harford County has the 6th highest per capita income but is 17th in schools funding. Is that wise and balanced decision making by our government?
Specifically speaking, How is throwing more money at teachers going to improve the school system? Teachers have been complaining since the beginning of time about “low pay” and yet, we all have seemed to come out with an education.
Parent, your post are either on the wrong story or you are totally clueless… This is about how a pension shift will further weaken the economy. These pensions are NOT sustainable… It is not the governments job to provide anyone with retirement!
Agreed. We should pay our bills, honor our contracts and live within our budget. Sustainability is a good theme.
I don’t believe that it is conservative or “living within our means” to take on hundreds of millions of dollars in additional public debt, while cutting taxes and claiming poor to your employees. Do you?
@get it together…..the money has to come from somewhere….you are the clueless one. You have fiscal conservatives wanting to cut taxes. The HCEA doing a terrible job at getting money for teachers. The pensions are going to be taken over by the county and its gonna hurt all other agencies in the county. If people where left up to their pensions, NO ONE WOULD HAVE A GOOD ONE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
In case you didn’t know all county employees get pensions, police, fire, county workers and teachers. It is not that they aren’t sustainable, it is that they were not properly funded in the past when times were better and we had a higher percentage of our population working. Likewise, our pensions are not any great golden parachute. They are extremely modest. Why is it that you question teachers’ pensions and salary, yet you have no problem with Mr. Craig and all his department heads making 6 figures? I will never make what he makes. In fact Mr. Craig makes double what most teachers make.
Oh, I almost forgot, David Craig will get a substantial pensions when he finally retires. His share will be many times the average teacher’s.
Shouldn’t Craig should get more than the average teacher since he was in HCPS for 34 years as a teacher and also an administrator (assistant principal)? Whether or not he should get a pension for being elected Mayor of Havre de Grace (four times), to the Maryland House and Senate, and County Executive (twice), his service to HCPS is far from the contributions of an average teacher.
Just curious – what is the average length of time a teacher is employed by HCPS?
I agree, he probably should get a better pension. However, if folks are going to bash pensions then shouldn’t they bash them all and bash the more expensive ones more?
I don’t know how long the average teacher works for HCPS. In the past, many teachers worked their whole career here. If things don’t change soon, I doubt that will be the case in the future.
The teachers pensions are being moved to the county. NOW the HCEA can screw that up and make the average teacher suffer at the hands of inept union leaders.
Pensions are determined by state legislation. HCEA has little or nothing to do with that. As far as “screwing” the average teacher. Were it not for HCEA, the average teacher would be making14% less, would have terrible healthcare benefits, would have even longer work hours and even worse working conditions. Were it not for HCEA, the average teacher would be required to supervise lunches and would have little or no planning time. Were it not for HCEA, the average teacher would have no protection against false accusations or capricious disciplinary actions by their supervisor. Were it not for HCEA and other unions, the average teacher would be a second class citizen, who would be forced to remain silent for fear of dismissal. Whether you like unions, are in a union or not, teachers’ unions have made a tremendous positive difference for students and teachers alike.
Ryan….take your rose colored glasses off and see what the HCEA is doing. I belong to a union and can see what happened. The teachers don’t have a good opinion of the HCEA.
Some teachers do and some don’t. I am fully aware of what HCEA is doing. We need to do more but to be successful we need to have more participation. Our schools are being held hostage by a self-serving politician. Our leadership has tried to hard to cooperate with irrational demands, been tricked and manipulated in the past. It won’t continue. HCEA is fighting for students and teachers. We are fighting to improve our schools and to make sure that the funds necessary to improve schools are provided by our county. We are fighting to prevent even more cuts to state funding, cause by Mr. Craig’s reckless underfunding of schools. At no time did HCEA attempt to take money from other unions, “take all the money” for themselves or in anyway soak the tax payers. We support fair wages for all. We support quality health insurance for all. We have prevented dramatic cuts to teachers’ healthcare and protected their rights.
Yeah! Damn that Dave Craig and his damn tricks! So, he tried to give your members extra money. Thank God you and Randy figured out that evil plan and put an end to it, at least for a while.
I hope you taught him a lesson and he won’t try to give the teachers anything else in his remaining time in office. We can only pray that you will stay vigilent and not let him distribute any additional funds to the counties when he’s the Governor.
I only wish we had a team like you two at my place of employment to keep extra money out of my paycheck.
Although fiscally conservative, I have no problem with the taxpayers of Harford County wanting improved services or more services. If I don’t like it, I can always move somewhere more to my tastes. However, the new services need to budgeted and the bills have to be paid. So either raise taxes or cut something else. We can’t keep all current services at the same levels and add more without raising taxes. The only other solution is to cut waste and streamline services that we as a county can control. I prefer the cut and streamline approach first, but a balanced approach may be the selected option. Harford County population is about 250,000 and maybe half pay some taxes. We need about about $10,000,000. It would come out to about $80 a taxpayer or $6.67 a month which is a trip to McDonalds. However, the point is not the $80 bucks, but the precedent of raising taxes first before looking at other solutions and not paying for services. The County Executive should be more realistic and reassuring, but he is a master of the political game.
We would be working at a surplus if the impact fee had not been cut in half and the tax rate had not been lowered 3 times.
I am sorry. I need to correct myself. Harford County has been operating at a surplus level for two years. If Mr. Craig had not spearheaded the cuts to taxes and the impact fee the county would be working at a huge surplus!
the county needs to adopt the constant yield rule and allowed by law. In times of down assessments, the county should raise the property tax rate to the level needed to get the funding needs equal to the past year’s level, that’s what the TEA PARTY claimed for years until the opposite served their purpose better which is to “starve the beast” as they call it. Free loading and tax evaders abound even when it came to a $20.00 every two years for a Rental Registration!!!. The county employees, teachers and sheriff deputies need to become more vocal as group to demand raises when this county keeps cutting taxes, having surpluses and then claiming that they can’t afford to pay their workers a fair wage.
Frankly, you speak thee truth. Everyone public and private sector should stop allowing the privileged class represented by Mr. Craig to pit them against each other. We are all getting played. How is it better to pay a little less, when your schools, roads, water treatment system, power grid, and other public infrastructure is crumbling. Teachers should stop allowing themselves to be turned against each other by manipulative politicians, who claim to be on their side but perpetually act against the best interests of students and teachers alike. THe other public employees should realize that it is not the HCEA that is mucking things up but the County Executive who has been crying poor while squirreling away millions of dollars in a rainy day fund and dramatically increase public bond debt to funnel money to his developer friends. Everyone should be concerned about our schools. HCPS is doing the best it can with the funds provided but bubble gum and band aids only hold the dam for so long. Our children will suffer the folly of Mr. Craig’s political ambitions.
Ryan Bubrey you and your progressive liberal ilk are the problem.
“Where justice is denied, where poverty is enforced, where ignorance prevails, and where any one class is made to feel that society is an organized conspiracy to oppress, rob and degrade them, neither persons nor property will be safe.”
Frederick Douglass
Frederick Douglass was a great and noble man…Ryan Burbey you are a small and selfish.
Well, Sam, I will not insult your character since I do not know you. However, those that know me, I know would tell you that I am not selfish in the least, except the pleasure that I derive from helping others.
“If you are humble nothing will touch you, neither praise nor disgrace, because you know what you are.” Mother Teresa
What a jerk you are to post an accolade about yourself. You are generous with taxpayer’s money.
“People are often unreasonable and self-centered. Forgive them anyway.
If you are kind, people may accuse you of ulterior motives. Be kind anyway.
If you are honest, people may cheat you. Be honest anyway.
If you find happiness, people may be jealous. Be happy anyway.
The good you do today may be forgotten tomorrow. Do good anyway.
Give the world the best you have and it may never be enough. Give your best anyway.
For you see, in the end, it is between you and God. It was never between you and them anyway.”
Mother Teresa
“Social1sm is a philosophy of failure, the creed of ignorance, and the gospel of envy.”
“The inherent vice of capitalism is the unequal sharing of blessings; the inherent virtue of social1sm is the equal sharing of miseries.”
Burbrey, Winston Churchill is long gone but he left these words for you and other fools like you.
What is more “socialist” than incurring hundreds of millions of dollars in public debt to fund pet projects and enrich your cronies? Oh, I didn’t mean socialist, I meant unconscionable and corrupt…
“It is easier to build strong children than to repair broken men.”
? Frederick Douglass
hey ryan….maybe you should tell your quotes to the HCEA. Im sure they would find away to mess that up too.
“We know only too well that what we are doing is nothing more than a drop in the ocean. But if the drop were not there, the ocean would be missing something.”
Mother Teresa
Blessed Mother Teresa was talking about the poor in the world and not the HCEA.
Care to guess who said this…
“But restoring the American dream requires more than restoring a sound, productive economy, vitally important as that is. It requires a return to spiritual and moral values, values so deeply held by those who came here to build a new life. We need to restore those values in our daily life, in our neighborhoods and in our government’s dealings with the other nations of the world…. These are the values inspiring those brave workers in Poland. The values that have inspired other dissidents under Communist domination who’ve been willing to go into the gulag and suffer the torture of imprisonment because of their dissidence. They remind us that where free unions and collective bargaining are forbidden, freedom is lost. They remind us that freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction.”
You are a pathetic to invoke Reagan. Reagan is the same President who rightly broke Professional Air Traffic Controllers Organization (PATCO).
Conflating a speech against totalitarianism with teacher’s unions is quite a stretch. If Reagan was alive today he would most likely support Gov. Scott Walker of WI.
Finally, Reagan appointed NLRB Chairman Donald Dotson who fought to eliminate collective bargaining.
“They remind us that where free unions and collective bargaining are forbidden, freedom is lost. They remind us that freedom is never more than one generation away from extinction.”
You are a wretched human being.
Public sector unions should never exist and unlike your perversion of Reagan, I give you below a proper and relevant FDR quote.
“All Government employees should realize that the process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service. It has its distinct and insurmountable limitations when applied to public personnel management. The very nature and purposes of Government make it impossible for administrative officials to represent fully or to bind the employer in mutual discussions with Government employee organizations. The employer is the whole people, who speak by means of laws enacted by their representatives in Congress. Accordingly, administrative officials and employees alike are governed and guided, and in many instances restricted, by laws which establish policies, procedures, or rules in personnel matters.”
FDR
Notice he said limitations not elimination.
What a dick you are for taking one word out of context. FDR said “distinct and insurmountable limitations when applied to public personnel management”.
Even an ardent ideological hack such as Ryan Bubrey can’t revise and rehabilitate “insurmountable limitations” to mean something other than what was said.
You will notice my name is Ryan not Richard…Below is the complete quote from Roosevelt’s letter where he clearly states that his purpose is to assert that federal employees not strike. It is ridiculous to assert that Roosevelt would be in favor of union bashing or elimination of collective bargaining rights. Likewise, please take note that Roosevelt also asserts public sector employees’ right to fair working conditions and pay. Likewise, teachers do not have the right to strike in MD, which is consistent with FDR’s quote. Similarly, the quote imbibes a need for both public sector mgt. and employees to act in thoughtful concert for the good of the public whom they serve. This is not happening currently in Harford County. Mr. Craig has very perniciously underfunded school to the detriment of out entire community but most immediately and profoundly to the detriment of our children. Thank you for calling this quote to my attention, Sam I am not such a thorough reader, as I would not have been aware of it otherwise.
August 16, 1937
Franklin D. Roosevelt
1937
The American Presidency Project
My dear Mr. Steward:
As I am unable to accept your kind invitation to be present on the occasion of the Twentieth Jubilee Convention of the National Federation of Federal Employees, I am taking this method of sending greetings and a message.
Reading your letter of July 14, 1937, I was especially interested in the timeliness of your remark that the manner in which the activities of your organization have been carried on during the past two decades “has been in complete consonance with the best traditions of public employee relationships.” Organizations of Government employees have a logical place in Government affairs.
The desire of Government employees for fair and adequate pay, reasonable hours of work, safe and suitable working conditions, development of opportunities for advancement, facilities for fair and impartial consideration and review of grievances, and other objectives of a proper employee relations policy, is basically no different from that of employees in private industry. Organization on their part to present their views on such matters is both natural and logical, but meticulous attention should be paid to the special relationships and obligations of public servants to the public itself and to the Government.
All Government employees should realize that the process of collective bargaining, as usually understood, cannot be transplanted into the public service. It has its distinct and insurmountable limitations when applied to public personnel management. The very nature and purposes of Government make it impossible for administrative officials to represent fully or to bind the employer in mutual discussions with Government employee organizations. The employer is the whole people, who speak by means of laws enacted by their representatives in Congress. Accordingly, administrative officials and employees alike are governed and guided, and in many instances restricted, by laws which establish policies, procedures, or rules in personnel matters.
Particularly, I want to emphasize my conviction that militant tactics have no place in the functions of any organization of Government employees. Upon employees in the Federal service rests the obligation to serve the whole people, whose interests and welfare require orderliness and continuity in the conduct of Government activities. This obligation is paramount. Since their own services have to do with the functioning of the Government, a strike of public employees manifests nothing less than an intent on their part to prevent or obstruct the operations of Government until their demands are satisfied. Such action, looking toward the paralysis of Government by those who have sworn to support it, is unthinkable and intolerable. It is, therefore, with a feeling of gratification that I have noted in the constitution of the National Federation of Federal Employees the provision that “under no circumstances shall this Federation engage in or support strikes against the United States Government.”
I congratulate the National Federation of Federal Employees the twentieth anniversary of its founding and trust that the convention will, in every way, be successful.
Very sincerely yours,
Mr. Luther C. Steward,
President,
National Federation of Federal Employees,
10 Independence Avenue, S.W., Washington, D.C.
APP Note: Although this letter appears to be signed, “Very sincerely yours, Mr. Luther C. Steward, President, National Federation of Federal Employees, 10 Independence Avenue, S.W., Washington, D.C.,” the letter is from Roosevelt to Steward. The placement of the addressee’s name and address at the bottom of the document was an editorial decision in the original “Public Papers and Addresses of Franklin D. Roosevelt.” The American Presidency Project’s policy is to reproduce documents in their original form.
Citation: Franklin D. Roosevelt: “Letter on the Resolution of Federation of Federal Employees Against Strikes in Federal Service,”
Read more at the American Presidency Project: Franklin D. Roosevelt: Letter on the Resolution of Federation of Federal Employees Against Strikes in Federal Service http://www.presidency.ucsb.edu/ws/index.php?pid=15445#ixzz1nYBHg0Vb
The results are crap.
Ryan, you suffer fools better than I ever would. Stop trying to convince these fools whom think quality, professionalism and providing the best service can be gotten while paying lower wages than the competition, namely the counties around us while the county sits on an ever expanding rainy day fund and a surplus to add to it.
If money was the answer to improved public education outcomes we’d have the most educated populace in the world.
Teachers unions are the greatest danger to students, parents and the nation.
That is perhaps the most narrow-mined and uninformed post yet.
Compelling rebuttal Ryan!
You can’t defend the indefensible. The cost of our local and national public education system has steadily and dramatically increased over the past 40 years with no appreciable improvement.
I blame teachers unions and big government ideologues like you.
What do you base this conclusion upon? Do you have any evidence? You do know that we currently teach middle school students what was taught in high school twenty years ago…What do you base your evaluation of our educational system upon?
Test scores for K-12 have been flat since 1970.
Please post the study with the actual comparisons. I do not believe that they exist. Similarly, there is not an accurate means of comparison, since the expectations are different. You can not measure the full impact or success of our schools in test scores. The most admirable victory of public education is that we educate everyone. Do we need to constantly change and improve our schools, yes. However, to assert that unions are preventing this from happening or that we are getting diminishing returns vs. cost is ridiculous and counterintuitive. Everything costs more over time. A Big Mac cost more than it did in 1970. Does that mean McDonald’s is less successful? Electricity costs more does that mean your lights work less successfully? Controlling cost in education is important. However, education in a technological era is inherently more expensive than preparing the bulk of our children to work in factories or as other manual laborers. My point is this. Properly educating our children for a bright and successful future where they can compete in the global marketplace requires sufficient funding for expanded programing and innovation. This has not happened in Harford County. Harford County has the 6th highest per capita income in MD and funds its schools at the 7th lowest level, 17 out of 24 counties and sinking…We must change our priorities but fully funding our schools and our children’s futures!
U.S. Department of Education, National Assessment of Educational Progress, 2009.
You are foolish, foolish man who defends incompetence and wants to reward mediocrity. Teachers unions protect the status quo and students, teachers and taxpayers suffer.
Try checking the data…It clearly states that all scores were higher than 1992.
Scores of students at grade 4 unchanged from 2009 and improve at grade 8
The average fourth-grade reading score in 2011 remained unchanged from 2009, but was 4 points higher than in 1992.
The average eighth-grade reading score in 2011 was 1 point higher than in 2009, and 5 points higher than in 1992.
See all the average scores for students in grade 4 and grade 8.
Higher percentage of eighth-graders perform at or above Proficient than in 2009.
At grade 4, the percentages of students performing at or above Basic, at or above Proficient, or at Advanced did not change significantly from 2009 to 2011, but were higher in 2011 than in 1992.
At grade 8, the percentage of students performing at or above the Basic level did not change significantly from 2009 to 2011, but was higher in 2011 than in 1992. The percentage of students at or above Proficient in 2011 was higher than in 2009 and 1992.
See all the achievement level results for grade 4 and grade 8.
Scores of White, Black, and Hispanic eighth-grade students higher in 2011
Scores were higher in 2011 than in 2009 for White, Black, and Hispanic students at grade 8.
Scores for Asian/Pacific Islander and American Indian/Alaska Native eighth-grade students did not change significantly in 2011 from 2009.
Again, Thank you Sam. I did not realize that the NES tests went back to 1970. Below are the reading results. You can clearly see that the national scores have climbed over time.
220 (0.9)
2004 National 216 (1.0)
2004¹ National 219 (1.1)
1999¹ National 212 (1.3)
1996¹ National 212 (1.0)
1994¹ National 211 (1.2)
1992¹ National 211 (0.9)
1990¹ National 209 (1.2)
1988¹ National 212 (1.1)
1984¹ National 211 (0.8)
1980¹ National 215 (1.0)
1975¹ National 210 (0.7)
1971¹ National 208
As with the previously posted age 8 scores for Reading you can see the scores climb over time although not as much. Remember, these are National scores and we are both testing and educating far more students now.
Average scale scores for long-term trend reading, age 13 by year, jurisdiction and all students [TOTAL]: 2008, 2004, 1999, 1996, 1994, 1992, 1990, 1988, 1984, 1980, 1975, and 1971
Year Jurisdiction All students
Average Scale Score Standard Error
¹ Original assessment format.
NOTE: The NAEP Long-Term Trend Reading scale ranges from 0 to 500. Some apparent differences between estimates may not be statistically significant.
SOURCE: U.S. Department of Education, Institute of Education Sciences, National Center for Education Statistics, National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP), 1971, 1975, 1980, 1984, 1988, 1990, 1992, 1994, 1996, 1999, 2004 and 2008 Long-Term Trend Reading Assessments.
2008 National 260 (0.8)
2004 National 257 (1.0)
2004¹ National 259 (1.0)
1999¹ National 259 (1.0)
1996¹ National 258 (1.0)
1994¹ National 258 (0.9)
1992¹ National 260 (1.2)
1990¹ National 257 (0.8)
1988¹ National 257 (1.0)
1984¹ National 257 (0.6)
1980¹ National 258 (0.9)
1975¹ National 256 (0.8)
1971¹ National 255 (0.9)
The results are anemic.
You can put lipstick on a pig if you want, but it’s still a pig.
Again, 17 year old scores are higher now than 1970. Also, remember that far fewer students drop out to enter the work force now than in the past. Also notice, it is not the same test.
Average scale scores for long-term trend reading, age 17 by year, jurisdiction and all students [TOTAL]: 2008, 2004, 1999, 1996, 1994, 1992, 1990, 1988, 1984, 1980, 1975, and 1971
Year Jurisdiction All students
Average Scale Score Standard Error
¹ Original assessment format.
NOTE: The NAEP Long-Term Trend Reading scale ranges from 0 to 500. Some apparent differences between estimates may not be statistically significant.
SOURCE: U.S. Department of Education, Institute of Education Sciences, National Center for Education Statistics, National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP), 1971, 1975, 1980, 1984, 1988, 1990, 1992, 1994, 1996, 1999, 2004 and 2008 Long-Term Trend Reading Assessments.
2008 National 286 (0.9)
2004 National 283 (1.1)
2004¹ National 285 (1.2)
1999¹ National 288 (1.3)
1996¹ National 288 (1.1)
1994¹ National 288 (1.3)
1992¹ National 290 (1.1)
1990¹ National 290 (1.1)
1988¹ National 290 (1.0)
1984¹ National 289 (0.8)
1980¹ National 285 (1.2)
1975¹ National 286 (0.8)
1971¹ National 285 (1.2)
Math in 8 year olds shows a greater climb.
Average scale scores for long-term trend mathematics, age 9 by year, jurisdiction and all students [TOTAL]: 2008, 2004, 1999, 1996, 1994, 1992, 1990, 1986, 1982, and 1978
Year Jurisdiction All students
Average Scale Score Standard Error
¹ Original assessment format.
NOTE: The NAEP Long-Term Trend Mathematics scale ranges from 0 to 500. Some apparent differences between estimates may not be statistically significant.
SOURCE: U.S. Department of Education, Institute of Education Sciences, National Center for Education Statistics, National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP), 1978, 1982, 1986, 1990, 1992, 1994, 1996, 1999, 2004 and 2008 Long-Term Trend Mathematics Assessments.
2008 National 243 (0.8)
2004 National 239 (0.9)
2004¹ National 241 (0.9)
1999¹ National 232 (0.8)
1996¹ National 231 (0.8)
1994¹ National 231 (0.8)
1992¹ National 230 (0.8)
1990¹ National 230 (0.8)
1986¹ National 222 (1.0)
1982¹ National 219 (1.1)
1978¹ National 219 (0.8)
Likewise, Math in 13 year olds is climbing over time.
Average scale scores for long-term trend mathematics, age 13 by year, jurisdiction and all students [TOTAL]: 2008, 2004, 1999, 1996, 1994, 1992, 1990, 1986, 1982, and 1978
Year Jurisdiction All students
Average Scale Score Standard Error
¹ Original assessment format.
NOTE: The NAEP Long-Term Trend Mathematics scale ranges from 0 to 500. Some apparent differences between estimates may not be statistically significant.
SOURCE: U.S. Department of Education, Institute of Education Sciences, National Center for Education Statistics, National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP), 1978, 1982, 1986, 1990, 1992, 1994, 1996, 1999, 2004 and 2008 Long-Term Trend Mathematics Assessments.
2008 National 281 (0.9)
2004 National 279 (1.0)
2004¹ National 281 (1.0)
1999¹ National 276 (0.8)
1996¹ National 274 (0.8)
1994¹ National 274 (1.0)
1992¹ National 273 (0.9)
1990¹ National 270 (0.9)
1986¹ National 269 (1.2)
1982¹ National 269 (1.1)
1978¹ National 264 (1.1)
As with reading in 17 year olds the increase in scores is not as pronounced. However, you will also notice that none of the math scores go back to 1971. They stop at 1970.
Average scale scores for long-term trend mathematics, age 17 by year, jurisdiction and all students [TOTAL]: 2008, 2004, 1999, 1996, 1994, 1992, 1990, 1986, 1982, and 1978
Year Jurisdiction All students
Average Scale Score Standard Error
¹ Original assessment format.
NOTE: The NAEP Long-Term Trend Mathematics scale ranges from 0 to 500. Some apparent differences between estimates may not be statistically significant.
SOURCE: U.S. Department of Education, Institute of Education Sciences, National Center for Education Statistics, National Assessment of Educational Progress (NAEP), 1978, 1982, 1986, 1990, 1992, 1994, 1996, 1999, 2004 and 2008 Long-Term Trend Mathematics Assessments.
2008 National 306 (0.6)
2004 National 305 (0.7)
2004¹ National 307 (0.8)
1999¹ National 308 (1.0)
1996¹ National 307 (1.2)
1994¹ National 306 (1.0)
1992¹ National 307 (0.9)
1990¹ National 305 (0.9)
1986¹ National 302 (0.9)
1982¹ National 298 (0.9)
1978¹ National 300 (1.0)
So in conclusion Sam, you are inaccurate in your conclusion that the scores are flat line or have not changed. Likewise, it is not particularly valid to compare national scores since the rules governing education and funding are mostly either state or locally generated. Included in these scores are states like Alabama, Mississippi and Texas which have abysmal educational systems and do not invest in education. The impact of funding on education in in arguable. Maryland has continued to be the #1 state for public schools because it has maintained a basic level of funding. Harford County on the other had has not maintained this commitment to its schools.
The average per year student cost in 1970 was $842 and in 2008 it was $10,297.
Students, parents and taxpayers gotten a poor return on our education investment.
Also, Sam, you should be aware that age of school attendance has been raised over time. Students must be at least one year older than in 1971. Thus, they are attaining at overall higher levels with one year less schooling. Can you deny that that is progress? Your argument is bankrupt and flies in the face of reality and the data which you offer as evidence. Likewise, the inflation rate since the 1970’s is astronomical. You can not compare the cost of education now to the cost then without some very complicated math. Should schools do better, yes. Must schools do better in the future, yes. Will schools be able to do this without additional funds, no. I can remember many of my classmates dropping out of school, even in their senior year. I think we graduate a little more than half of my freshman class. Now, graduation rates of 70-75% are not acceptable. You can bash teachers, unions and our schools all you like. You can complain about spending more on education. However, the facts do not support you arguments. Many would like to politicize this issue but the simple fact is that our schools have improved over time, will continue to improve and need and increased commitment, as well as, funding to do this. Unions comprised of teachers and other educators have played and continue to play a key role in improving schools. In some counties, the county executive also plays a key role by investing in schools. Unfortunately, to date, Mr. Craig has chosen not to make our children’s’ futures a priority by adequately funding the school system.
Here is some more math for you Sam. In 1979, gas cost $0.36. It now costs about $4, give or take. If you simply make a ratio between our two figures, your investment return argument will be revealed as meritless. 842 divided by 10, 297 =.0817(truncated). .36 divided by 4.00 = .09. That means that our expenditures on education relative to inflation are virtually unchanged since 1970. More money is spent but the money is worth less because a dollar buys less. It is simple economics. Now, I doubt that this will change your opinion but the facts is the facts…Below are some more prices from 1970. You will see that everything costs more.
1970 PRICES
Cost of a new home: $26,600.00
Cost of a first-class stamp: $0.06
Cost of a gallon of regular gas: $0.36
Cost of a dozen eggs: $0.62
Cost of a gallon of Milk: 1.15
Ryan, you can defend the Teachers Unions and public schools all you want it won’t change the facts!
The average per year student cost in 1970 was $842 ($4552 adjusted to 2009 dollars) and in 2008 it was $10,297.
Students, parents and taxpayers have gotten a poor return on their education investment.
4.00 gas isn’t a good comparison Ryan. It was well under three before Obama intentionally drove it up.
B, you have a really short attention span. A friend posted a remark on his Facebook page yesterday typing $1.79 a gallon gas to the President’s arrival in 2009. Funny thing is he failed to mention it was $4 a gallon just the year before – just before the worldwide economic collapse. And precisely what do you know about the power of the President that he can change gas prices at will? Are you subscribing to Newt Gingrich’s comment he can restore gas to $2 a gallon? I suppose if you believe that, you will believe anything. How’s that tin foil hat fitting these days?
True gas went to 4 dollars, then Bush made the move to open up drilling, which drove down prices… Hence the 1.79. Clear evidence that the President has the ability to effect the price of gas. Obama has closed what Bush made available, then pretty much closed down the future drilling in the Gulf by chasing away many of the drilling rigs. This is partial explanation of why gas prices are rising even though supply is plentiful.
And no offense, but I don’t follow Burbey on Facebook.
Restoring gas to 2 dollars a gallon requires restoring the value of the dollar which Obama and Bush have destroyed by printing so much money to cover some of their spending. It would also require the government to be on sound financial ground which would allow the lowering of the gas taxes which make up much of the price we pay at the pump.
The part of me that requires a tin foil hat is thinking that arrogant jerks like you would stand aside and let people with common sense and answers fix the problem instead of continuing to spend ourselves into oblivion.
You are being willfully ignorant. Bush did no such thing. Demand for oil was down because of a worldwide economic collapse. The United States does not possess the capacity to impact oil prices based upon our additional production capabilities. No single country does. I have no idea where you get this stuff.
Demand is down now too, supply is plentiful, yet prices are sky rocketing. Why is that? Risk to future supply. Part from the middle east troubles, but that is a minority of our supply. Obama says no to a pipeline and prices go up. Obama denies permits in the gulf, even going against court order, and is down right hostile to exploration on public land in the U.S. and prices rise. Bush didn’t open new territory to oil exploration? Who is being willfully ignorant? http://edition.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/07/14/bush.offshore/index.html You are out of your mind if you think the country that has 1/4 of the refining ability for the whole world has no ability to affect prices.
It is not them for whom I suffer. We must keep fighting the good fight. Our children’s future is far too important.
It needs to be stated again that all teachers aren’t members of the union and don’t support their actions. Every time some like Mr. Cerveny or Mr. Burbey speaks on an issue, I get the feeling that all teachers get lumped in with them. This couldn’t be further from the truth, and it is an important distinction to make. It’s unfortunate that issues like education must be politicized, but there is no way to seperate the two.
As a parent and a citizen, I am speaking out for my children who must attend under funded schools. No teacher should be or feel lumped in with me.
@Ryan Bubrey
Are your children getting a good education in Harford County schools? Are they being educationally damage or harmed in any way?
I do not believe that the current funding provides equity for all schools. I do not believe if it continues they will receive a innovative education. I do believe the superintendent and the Board of Education are doing the best they can with the funds provided but it simply is not enough to provide the programing necessary for competing in the 21st century. Harford County is 17th in school funding out of 24 counties in MD. 17th is not good enough. I would prefer to keep the specifics of my children private.
I thought Maryland had 23 counties and Baltimore City. Yikes, maybe the schools really do need more money.
Mr. Burbey
A little academic integrity, if you please, and some credit where it is due.
Please use this site for reference. I belive it is the same that you are using for portraying the funding levels in Harford County.
http://mlis.state.md.us/2011RS/misc/OverviewMarylandLocalGovernments.pdf
Yes you are accurate in stating that Harford County is 17 out of 23 counties and Baltimore City.
Your analysis is quite incomplete and flawed, however. The postion is based on total, local, state and Federal, funding. If you will look at the other tables in chapter 7 you will see that Harford County is not getting what other counties ranked higher are getting from the State and Federal Government. If you look at table 7.5, local funding only, Harford County is ranked 12th. Much better I would say.
As to your disparaging of Mr. Craig, well you are certainly entitiled to your opinion, however baseless it may be. Please keep in mind however in your statements that last year the Federal government cut its funding to Harford County and the state flatlined theirs. Local funding was increased. Additionally, please keep in mind all of the debt service incurred by the County while Mr. Craig was in office. That debt service was for building new schools, and renovating existing schools. I believe that total number of projects is impressive.
Ok, Bri, Harford County ranks 17 out of 24 MD school systems for funding and is 16 out of 24 MD counties(excluding Baltimore City)…
My bad…typo 23…
You have a choice to home school or send them to a private school..
No, I have and my children have the right to an equal access to public education.
You also have the right to avoid saying things that are inflammatory and negative, please exercise that with some discretion if you can.
Porker: You are just like your buddy Jesse Bane. You dictate to others what you deem to be proper and say it with authority, as though you truly know what you are talking about. You don’t fool me and neither does Uncle Jesse.
Alright, I understand if you don’t want to comment on your children.
Are students in your school getting a good education? Are they being educationally damage or harmed in any way?
The facilities at our school are in no way comparable with other schools like Patterson Mill. We are doing the best we can. Our teachers and admin work very hard. However, we simply don’t have the PTA funds to fill the budgetary gaps.
To say nothing of the YBES and Fallston’s of the world!
@Bubrey
Again, are students in your school getting a good education? Are they being educationally damage or harmed in any way?
I am a teacher in Harford Co. I have been teaching here for 14 years. When I began teaching, I was forced to contribute to the pension system. If I had my choice, I would not be a part of the system. I would be happy to have my forced contribution completely refunded to me right now so that I could invest it as I choose to provide for my own retirement. Maryland can keep the matching funds and use it for something else. Don’t blame teachers for the cost of that pension. Not all of of us want it to begin with. Many people in my age group feel the same way. We are required to contribute to a broken system that won’t be there when we need it, much like Social Security and Medicare.
AMEN!!!! I feel the same way and I have 16 years under my belt.
Burbey isn’t going to like that you aren’t blindly following the liberal shepard.